Reinvention After 50: Success, Burnout & What Really Matters

Welcome And Why Hustle Fails

Announcer 0:07

Welcome to Aging with Purpose and Passion, the podcast designed to inspire your greatness and thrive through life. Get ready to conquer your fears. Here's your host, psychotherapist, coach, and empowerment expert, Beverly Glazer.

Beverley Glazer 0:34

What if the life you built through hustle is not what you're looking for today? Welcome to Aging with Purpose and Passion. I'm Beverly Glazer, a life and work transition coach and reinvention strategist for women over 50, helping you turn a lifetime of wisdom into your most impactful next act. And you can find me and this podcast at reinventimpossible.com. These conversations share real stories from women who refuse to let age, loss, or circumstances define what is still possible. We don't sugarcoat our challenges here. We learn from them, grow through them, and use them to see more clearly what matters now. Today's guest, Paige Arnoff Fenn, is an accidental entrepreneur, a branding expert, and founder of Mavens and Moguls, who built a powerful career in corporate marketing, internet startups, and independent consulting. But Paige's biggest lesson wasn't about branding. It was life. For six years, she and her husband faced death after death in their families while running their businesses, flying across the country, caregiving, making hard decisions and handling the estates. That changed everything. Paige learned that constant hustle is not the same as value, that being busy is not the same as being effective. And success means very little if it costs you the life you want. If you're caught up in the hustle or wearing the golden handcuffs, this conversation is for you. And stay with us to the end for takeaways and practical tips that you could do for your life right now. So welcome, Paige.

Growing Up In New Orleans

Paige Arnof-Fenn 2:35

Thank you, Beverly, for having me. I'm excited to chat with you today.

Beverley Glazer 2:40

Paige, it intrigues me. Louisiana, you grew up in Louisiana back in the day, one of my favorite states.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 2:49

Tell me about life back then. So I moved to New Orleans when I was uh starting eighth grade. My dad took a job uh and relocated our family. And to be honest, I was not looking forward to moving because at that age, you've got your friends and your life. But within a week of settling in, I immediately loved it. New Orleans is a great, fun place to visit, and it's a great place to grow up. Um, the food, the culture, the music, it's just it's one of the most interesting places, I think, in the world. Certainly one of the best um communities in the country. And I love my friends and my family, and I love going back. And uh it really is a special place. Yeah. I am with you 100%.

Beverley Glazer 3:47

I'm hearing you. I love New Orleans, yes.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 3:51

Um, did you come from a family of entrepreneurs, though? So it's a great question. I didn't I never thought of it that way, but now I realize absolutely positively. Um, both of my grandfathers um ran businesses, started businesses. They were incredibly entrepreneurial. And my my dad worked for the same, he was a banker, a commercial banker. He worked for two banks his entire career. Um and you know, my mom worked as a as a mom full-time. Sure. And um, I never really thought about entrepreneurship because I just knew my family was in business and they were all successful business people. Um, but the word entrepreneur was not anything people really used or talked about when I was growing up. But I knew I wanted to be in business. I knew I had a good business sensibility. Um, but I realized now, upon reflection, looking back on my career, um, as you said, I started my um my career in corporate America doing marketing at big Fortune 500 companies. I ran marketing for venture-backed startup companies before hanging out a shingle and starting my own firm. Um, but now when I look back, I realize I was always the person trying to bend, break, and change the rules at those big corporate jobs. And it's now amazing to me to think I was as successful as I was in the corporate environment, knowing that my real instincts, I think, are quite

The Drive To Achieve And Prove Yourself

Paige Arnof-Fenn 5:50

entrepreneurial.

Beverley Glazer 5:51

Yes, and you were right there in corporate. I mean, investment banking in New York. That's big time. Okay.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 6:01

My senior year in college, uh, Michael Douglas won the Oscar for the first Wall Street movie. And I saw the movie and I was hooked. I thought, boy, that looks fun. And, you know, this was before, you know, the that was a really big finance job to get right out of college. Um, they didn't have hedge funds, there wasn't a lot of um venture capital type stuff. So, you know, I went to Wall Street right after college and you know, learned a lot about spreadsheets and analyzing numbers and you know, buying and selling companies. But, you know, at the time, um it was just a very common path for um kind of go-getter college kids who wanted to make money, and that seemed to be a great path to do it.

Beverley Glazer 6:56

Right. And you felt it wasn't a good fit for you.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 7:00

It really wasn't. I I mean, they paid well. There were people very, very smart. I learned a lot of valuable life skills and a work ethic. So I'm very grateful for that chapter. But I realized very early on, pretty quickly, it was not gonna be a career path that I was gonna stick with. But the the financial analyst job that I took, um, it was a two-year commitment. And I made a commitment, so I was gonna stick it out, even though I knew long term I did not want to be in this field. I'd look at my boss, my boss's boss, my boss's boss's boss, and I realized I don't really want any of their jobs. And once you've kind of made that decision, um, you know, you you live up to your commitment, but I realized I needed to find a different path that was going to be more simpatico, that allowed me to kind of balance my left brain and right brain and have a good quality of life as well as a good life.

Beverley Glazer 8:09

And that drew you to marketing, though. And you also were no slouch there. So, what drew you to marketing?

Paige Arnof-Fenn 8:18

So it's uh it's funny. So when I look back at those two years in investment banking, a girlfriend and I were uh both going back to business school, and we took a trip to Europe this summer before, after we quit our jobs before we went back to grad school. And she loved finance and she wanted to go back to New York City and back to finance after getting her MBA. And I said, Oh my God, there's no way I would do this again. And she thought I was crazy. She said, Paige, they pay us so well, and you were so good at it. How can you say you're never going to do it again? And I said, I just didn't like the job. I didn't like how I spent my days, you know, I didn't like the lifestyle. And she said, that's impossible. You can't do something for as many hours a week or a week as we worked and not enjoy it. And I said, Well, it's true. There were only three things about our job on Wall Street that I liked at all. I liked the fact that when the deals closed, if you helped a company raise money or buy or sell parts of their business, I love the fact that as the junior person on the team, I had to take an ad out in the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times. They were called tombstone ads, those square tiles that you buy. And it shows that your bank represented either the buyer or the seller, and that the deal transaction was closed. Then you got to plan a closing dinner to celebrate the end of the deal. And then at the dinner, um, it was my job as the low man on the totem pole to um commemorate the successful transaction with a deal toy to give everyone a memento to thank them for being part of the project. And she said to me, Paige, I don't know why you thought you were a finance person. Everything you like about the job is marketing. None of it's fine, finance. You like the advertising, you like the event planning, you like the promotional aspects. Those are marketing things. You're not a finance person, you're a marketing person. And I didn't even know what she was talking about. I'd never taken a marketing class in my life. Um, I didn't know that marketing was a career. I knew there were doctors and lawyers and business people, but I, you know, I didn't know what marketing was. No one had ever talked to me about it. So when I went back to business school, the first semester, a required class

Wall Street Lessons And The Bad Fit

Paige Arnof-Fenn 11:05

was marketing. And wouldn't you know, I got the top grade in the class. And what I realized, and then I got a summer internship in marketing for the summer between first and second year. And they made me an offer to come back, and I went back to that company for about three and a half years. And so it's true, my friend was right, that that was just naturally what I gravitated to, what my strengths were, and I loved the work. It did not pay as well as Wall Street, but I really loved the fact that it did balance the creative and analytical side of my brain, and I could bring everything I had to the job, and it was fun. I never looked at the clock, I never, you know, worried about, you know, having fun, not having fun. I just loved the work, and I've been doing marketing ever since.

Beverley Glazer 11:59

And you work for big brands, Paige. We're talking Coke, we're talking Procter and Gamble, and and then you left corporate.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 12:08

I did. So, yeah, I mean, those Fortune 500 firms, you know, PG invented the concept of brand management. Coca-Cola is the most recognized and loved brand in the world. So I started at the top and I learned from the very, very best. But in the mid to late 90s, the Internet 1.0 started taking off, and all these startups were popping up, and they were raising tens of millions of dollars. And I was reading about them and hearing about them and watching my friends start companies and go work for these companies that just seemed fun. It was like the wild west, and it was like the shiny object that was distracting. And I I just kept reading about it, thinking about it, hearing about it, and I felt like I was missing out. And I was still pretty young, um, in my uh early 30s. And I just thought if I don't go try it, I may regret this the rest of my life. I knew I had a great resume. I'd gone to good college, good business school, I had good brand names on my resume. And I thought, okay, if I go try it and it's a bust, I can probably go back and get a good job again. But if I, if I don't, if I if I'm too risk averse, if I don't take the chance to try something new, um, I'm gonna look back and just regret that I didn't give it a try when I had the opportunity. So I quit my big cushy corporate job at Coca-Cola and um went and joined a company that no one had ever heard of before. You know, I when you give people your business card and you work for PG or Coke, they're immediately impressed. Everybody knows, you know, it big brand, big history, big budget. You know, these are uh brands that spend millions of dollars on advertising and promotion, and they sponsor things like the Olympics or the Oscars. So everybody knows those businesses. I went and joined a company no one had ever heard of. I think my boss and my parents thought I was having a nervous breakdown. They're like, you should just take a vacation. Don't quit a good job to go work for somebody that no one's ever heard of. But it was so much fun compared to the big jobs where you know there were decisions were made very slowly in big corporate hierarchy hierarchies. And, you know, everything was like

Finding Marketing And Loving The Work

Paige Arnof-Fenn 14:55

just there was a process for everything. Um with the startups, you know, it was the Wild West. Literally, fasten your seatbelt, you walk in in the morning, and what you thought you'd be doing, you know, would be uh pivoted immediately because of some new information in the market. And I just love the spontaneity and the energy and all the things you could try uh and just what what can you do today to grow to grow your business? And instead of taking six, nine, twelve months to do market research that was statistically significant, we would go and intercept people on the street or send out an email and get feedback in real time and make decisions just based on talking to you know a few dozen or maybe 50 people, and then we'd put it up on the internet, we'd change our website, see if it got traction, and if it didn't, we'd change it the next day. And I love the the fast pace, I love the entrepreneurial spirit and energy, and like I said, I've just never looked back, and I feel like you know, it was internet 1.0 before the market originally crashed. You could just experiment and learn. And my background turned out to be ideal for that internet 1.0 because I had the finance training, I had the marketing training. So I knew the logic and the theory behind why we were doing what we were doing, but I didn't have any of the hierarchy or burden to do things in a way that were boring or slow. You could just fasten your seatbelt, hit the gas, and go. And I was very fortunate to be the head of marketing at three different venture-backed tech companies, and all three of them had great exits. So they were all dot-com survivors, and I feel like I learned with every one of these opportunities, and it was just a really fun way to, you know, throw your energy and brains into something and watch it fly. And you you didn't win every day, a lot of setbacks, but it teaches you to pivot and you know kind of be resilient and pick yourself up and dust yourself off and try again. And it worked.

Beverley Glazer 17:47

Yes. And then you decided also to be this accidental entrepreneur on your own. Well, tell us about that.

Paige Arnof-Fenn 17:56

That's another pivot. Another pivot, yeah. Uh um, I never wrote a business plan. I never thought I would start a company. Like I said, the whole concept of entrepreneurship wasn't really on my radar ever. If you had met me in college or grad school, I wanted to be like Meg Whitman. I wanted to be a Fortune 500 CEO, run a big brand, a big company with thousands of employees around the world. But um after I uh was at the third startup, um all three of them had good exits. But the third one, um, right before uh so I was there for 9-11, which as you remember was a very unsettling time in our country and in the economy. And, you know, now today the stock market goes up and down, hundreds of points, and it's just like a regular week, no one even blinks anymore. But back then, when the market dropped, you know, hundreds of points after 9-11, companies went into a panic. Um, they were worried they'd never be able to raise money again, and so they wanted to conserve cash, and everybody cut their marketing department and cut their marketing budget after 9-11 just so they knew that they wouldn't, you know, run out of uh money. Um, so having already worked at the big companies and had three successful exits on the small companies, um, after 9-11, a lot of people came out of the woodwork and reached out to me and said, Paige, you know, we don't have a marketing department, we have a new product coming out, or we have a trade show coming up, or I've got a business ID, I need a website, I need a logo. Can you help me? And my first instinct was, no, I'm not uh an I never worked on the agency side. I mean, I know what you're asking for, but I'm the client, I'm the chief marketing officer. And my husband's like, Paige, you know what to do. These are people that trust you and know you. Like, send them an invoice, you know how to help them. And it wasn't like there were lots of jobs at that point. Again, after 9-11, all the marketing jobs dried up, and everyone I knew had lost their positions. So I had people and I had projects, and I just started putting them together. I called the women the marketing mavens, I called the guys the marketing moguls. For short, I called them mavens and moguls, and we just formed teams and helped clients do what they needed to do. I knew great people from all the the job history, and you know, having worked for big global companies like PG and

Leaving Security And Taking Bigger Risks

Paige Arnof-Fenn 21:00

Coke, I had contacts around the world, and a lot of the VCs who had invested in those companies I worked for, they all had portfolios of companies they were working with. And um once we helped one, they said, Can you help us do the same thing for a different one? Or I have another company we're about to invest in. They need a logo, they need a website, they need help. Can you help them? And so I said, sure. But like I said, it wasn't like I had made a plan to do this. And I thought after we helped a few companies, the economy would get back on its feet and I'd go back and take a job again. Well, that was 24 going on 25 years ago. And here I am still going strong. And if you had told me back then, I'd still be running this business. I didn't realize that when I put up the web. Website. Like this is my longest job. I think before starting Mavens and Moguls, the longest I ever worked anywhere was three and a half years. So now I've worked for myself for decades. And I joke that if I get sick of my boss this time, I'm dead because I don't think I can go back and work for anybody ever again.

Beverley Glazer 22:22

No, never. But during this process with mavens and moguls, life changed. It changed dramatically. You and your husband became caregivers and travelers and problem solvers and estate managers and all at once. How did you keep going with this?

Paige Arnof-Fenn 22:43

Yeah, it was a really unsettling time. We went through a six-year period. And he had started his own company around the same time. So we were a two entrepreneur, no pet, no plant, no kid family. And um of all of our siblings, we were the only ones that were self-employed without children. So um, and we were very close to our families. And sadly, both of his parents, both of my parents, my stepfather, my great aunt, who was the matriarch of my family, one of his siblings, all these people started to get sick and um decline and sadly die. And it was like a game of whack-a-mole. When one person got sick, um, then they decline and then the next person. So it was uh seven people over six years, and it was a really sad chapter. Um, but because we were working independently, we could jump on a plane with our laptop and our cell phone, and we could work from Mayo Clinic or um, you know, wherever they were being uh treated or helped. And uh we were like two ships passing in the night for years. Um, and he and I are the most businessy minded of our siblings as well. Um, you know, he has a PhD in economics, I've got an MBA. So we were business people, problem solvers. And um, you know, we were helping our families kind of navigate all the crazy things that you have to do um with health care and insurance and estate administration and estate planning. And uh I mean it was just a very sad chapter, but we were so grateful to both be able to have the time and the ability to do that. It really is a privilege, you know. I never understood um before, I hadn't really dealt with uh death from the front row ever before. Um, but it it was really um, you know, nothing's left unsaid, and you really do get to um be with people at a at a period where you know you really are so appreciative to have you know closure and um you know, as as sad as it was, it really does change your perspective. And I realized my definition of success changed a lot because of that chapter. You know, you don't really look at your title or how much money you make, or um, you know, the finish lines in the same, you know, how many houses, how many cars, your bank account, like you realize that's not really what matters in life, you know. When you see people on their deathbed, um what really matters at the end are the relationships that you have, the people whose lives you've touched, and to know that their life is better in some way that because you were part of it. And so, you know, it was a very uh it was just a challenging time, but it really helped me um change my priorities in a way that I never would have uh guessed. I think, you know, before all of this, um, when I was starting my business, I was just a networking machine. I'd get up in the morning, go to a breakfast meeting, have an action, you know, packed calendar of meetings and lunches and coffees and evening commitments, networking. And when people started getting sick and needing us, um, you know, I I couldn't I couldn't do the networking that I had kind of been known for. Um, I'd be getting ready for a trip, then I'd be gone for a week or 10 days, then I'd come back and I'd have to catch up. So in the old days, I would go to more networking in a day than most people did in a week.

Accidental Entrepreneurship After 9-11

Paige Arnof-Fenn 27:10

And um once, you know, I was kind of dealing with the health and wellness uh chapter, I I wouldn't uh I wouldn't do nearly the kind of networking because I just didn't have the energy and bandwidth. And frankly, I wasn't here to do it. Um so what I what I learned was it was kind of an interesting lesson. When I got back from a trip and I got caught up, maybe I'd go to two or three networking events before I had to get on a plane and you know, go go back to the West Coast or um wherever we were needed. And what I noticed was I'd go to these events and I'd see people who I used to run into multiple times a week, and now I'm only seeing them a couple of times a month. And they were like, Paige, I haven't seen you. Um, where where are you what events are you going to? Where have you been? Because I clearly don't, you know, I I must not be at the right places because I don't see you anymore. And I didn't tell people that, like, you know, unfortunately, we have all these close family members who are dying. You know, I just said I've been on the road, it's been a very busy time, and I, you know, it's great to see you again. But what I realized was, you know, I didn't miss all the running around like a chicken with my head cut off. And they didn't really like they noticed, but it didn't change my business. I mean, in a bad way, it almost made my business move up the food chain because I had to be much more uh deliberate and intentional. And so when I'd meet people and I'd send them a proposal, in the old days, I would follow up immediately with an email, with a phone call. Did you get the proposal? Do you have any questions? You know, what do you need anything to make a decision? But now I'd send the proposal, I'd jump on a plane, I'd be gone for a week, I'd come back and catch up for a week. So now we're talking, it's been two, three weeks, and I'd reach out to the CEO and I'd say, Oh my God, I know it's been a few weeks. I sent you the proposal, I haven't heard back from you. Is there any questions? Is there anything I can answer? And the CEO would say, Paige, you must be the busiest consultant in town because I met with a handful of people. They've all been stalking me. You know, you obviously have a real business. I appreciate the fact that you've given me time to reflect. You're the consultant we want to hire for the project. I'm really busy. Can you, if you don't hear from me in three weeks, call me back and we'll get started. And Beverly, when I tell you this happened all the time. And I thought, this is crazy. I'm I feel like it was gonna hurt me and it's helped me. And so after that chapter was winding down, you know, everyone that was sick had died, and George and I were doing uh all the estate administration, I realized I do not need to fill my dance card with all these runaround crazy networking, trying to hit two or three events on

Caregiving Years That Redefined Success

Paige Arnof-Fenn 30:45

the same night. Go to one early, go to one in the middle, go to one at the end. It's like, don't do that. It's not, you know, you're running yourself ragged and it's not helping your business. You're spreading yourself too thin, you're burning the candle at both ends. So, you know, be more deliberate, be more intentional. And it changed everything. I feel like my business got better. It really was kind of a less is more. Um, people, you know, instead of going to these networking events with hundreds of people in a hotel ballroom, I would go to like, you know, a dinner with a small group of people or a round table or something much smaller and more intimate. And those conversations were much more interesting, and you got to know people better. And so it's been a great lasting impression and um legacy to my business where we've grown in a way that has been more sustainable and it's made me more resilient.

Beverley Glazer 31:55

What would you say to a successful woman, Paige, on the fast track? You can't get out, you're tied to the paycheck, the golden handcuffs. What would you say to that woman?

Paige Arnof-Fenn 32:09

So, you know, it would be very helpful if you can kind of do a retrospective. Think about who your best customers and clients are, and how did you find them, how did they find you, and try and replicate those relationships. It doesn't matter whether your business is B2B or B2C or nonprofit technology, whatever category, whatever industry, every business is P2P. It's person to person. And I think what I've come to appreciate and realize is you know, there's a human conversation, there's a human relationship behind everything in business. And I think, especially in these days of artificial intelligence and technology and robots, the more human you can be, the more personal you can be. Um, that is your superpower. That's where you can stand out versus your competition. And I feel like, you know, again, don't spread yourself too thin. Less can be more. And like with social media and all the platforms and technology, it's very easy to spread yourself too thin and try and be everywhere all the time. But I don't think long term that's a winning strategy. I think it's much more important to really understand kind of where your superpower strengths are and focus on that and you know, pick your lane and be the very best version of yourself, as opposed to trying to copy everybody else, because it's it's just not a great way to build a sustainable long-term business.

Beverley Glazer 34:10

Thank you. Thank you, Paige. Paige Arnoff Fenn is a branding expert, an accidental entrepreneur and founder of a global marketing firm, Mavens and Moguls. After building a career with major brands and fast growth startups, she launched her own business and has led it for more than two decades. Today, she helps leaders build meaningful brands while living with sharper priorities, greater purpose, and a clearer sense of what matters most. Here are a few takeaways from this episode. Being busy does not prove your value. Reinvention begins when you admit you do not want this, and your next chapter doesn't need to be louder, it can be wiser. If you've been identifying with this episode, here are some things that you could do for yourself right now. Stop one commitment or activity that drains more energy than it gives you back. Replace urgency with intention. Not everything requires your immediate response. And choose one thing you've been postponing that would bring you joy and peace. Put this in your schedule this week. For more episodes on making change after 50, check out Who Are You Without the Career, episode 181 and episode 174, Career Change at 50 on Aging with Purpose and Passion. And if you love podcasts for older women, the Late Bloomer Living Podcast gives you a fresh perspective on midlife and aging. That's latebloomerliving.com. And so, Paige, where can people find you? Please share your links.

Why Doing Less Created More Success

Paige Arnof-Fenn 36:05

Um, mavensandmoguls.com, M-A-V-E-N-S-A-N-D-M-O-G-U-L S dot com. And I'm also on LinkedIn. You'll see my last name is hyphenated, but on LinkedIn it's all smushed together, page aren't off then. And if if you forget all of that, you can always Google Page and Mavens, because with my ampersand between Mavens and Moguls and my hyphen in my last name, there are a lot of words to remember. But my client always says whenever she can't find my info, she googles page and mavens, and I pop right up. So thank goodness for search engine optimization, it works.

Beverley Glazer 36:47

Terrific. All pages links also will be in the show notes right here and on my site too. That's reinventedpossible.com. And so, my friends, what's next for you? If you're ready to move from stuck to unstoppable, download my free roadmap, and that's in the show notes. And please add us to your playlist, share it with a friend, and remember, you only have one life, so live it with purpose and passion.

Announcer 37:23

Thank you for joining us. You can connect with Bev on her website, reinventimpossible.com. And while you're there, join our newsletter. Subscribe so you don't miss an episode. Until next time, keep aging with purpose and passion. And celebrate life.