Exploring Ethical Non-Monogamy: How Matchmakers Can Support Diverse Relationship Models

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Welcome to the Matchmaker Mentor
Podcast, the show where aspiring

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and experienced matchmakers come
to sharpen their skills, grow

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their businesses, and elevate
the matchmaking industry.

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Your host is Arlene Washburn, an
award-winning ethical

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matchmaking advocate, mentor,
and industry innovator.

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Let's dive in.
Welcome back to the matchmaker

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mentor podcast.
I'm your host Arlene Washburn

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here to guide you aspiring and
experienced matchmakers and

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their clients or anyone in the
love industry with insights that

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will help you grow and innovate
and thrive.

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And before we jump in, I want to
let our listeners know that

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today's episode will be voice
only.

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Our guest works with high net
worth individuals, high profile

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professionals and even
celebrities, people who often

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value privacy in their personal
lives and relationships.

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In fact, if you were to see my
guests at an event, it would

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automatically disclose the
nature of the gathering.

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So out of respect for that
discretion, today we're keeping

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the spotlight on his voice, his
expertise rather than video.

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And today we're diving into a
topic that's becoming

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increasingly mainstream, open
relationships and how

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professionals in this lifestyle
are elevating the experience far

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beyond the ABS and swipe
culture.

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I am so cool to welcome George
Co founder of the group and

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managing member of the resort.
George brings over 20 years of

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experience in building luxury
spaces and curating events for

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professionals seeking open
relationships.

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He's also a former NASDAQ CEO
which makes his journey from

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Wall Street to private members
only communities both

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fascinating and inspiring.
Welcome, George.

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Thank you for having me.
I am so excited for this

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conversation.
I know we talked about it months

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ago and then all hell broke
loose and life took over.

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But George, I'm so excited to
have you here and I want to

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start with your journey.
You went from being a NASDAQ CEO

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to creating a high end private
community for open

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professionals.
What inspired that transition?

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Well, I honestly have to say I
did the three things a newly

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divorced guy does.
Some of your listeners may have

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heard of this list or gone down
at themselves.

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The first thing you have to do
after getting a divorce is date

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a stripper for a week or their
or their intellectual

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equivalent.
Next on the list is the midlife

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crisis car and then the bachelor
pad that single guys think are

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great but grown women would
never live in.

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And it was during this phase.
It was during this phase that

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dating some woman who was much
too young for me walked into my

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ridiculous bachelor pad in New
York and said, oh, my gosh, this

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would be a great place for a
swinger party.

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And so scratching my chin like
an evil villain, I thought to

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myself, yeah, let's let's, let's
look into this.

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And so that was the impetus for
the for the first event.

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And I was in March of 2005.
Wow, OK, it's been a while and I

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think, I think you and I met in
London many, many years ago, I

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think at some event, but not a
swingers event.

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I have no problem with this
lifestyle.

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I actually have a student right
now who is a matchmaker for

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ethical non monogamy.
I don't have to participate in

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the lifestyle, but I don't
judge.

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And I think we need to have
these conversations to bring

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awareness because often the the
folks that are quote, UN quote,

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not in a lifestyle are cheating
on one another and stuff like

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that.
And so this is something totally

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different where everyone's on
board.

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So for those who are not
familiar, how would you define

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the lifestyle?
What does it actually entail?

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I truthfully want to just roll
it back to the very simplest of

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definitions, those who are
interested in something outside

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of traditional heterosexual
monogamy.

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That's it.
OK.

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OK.
When you say traditional

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heterosexual monogamy, does that
mean that when you have an open

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lifestyle that the individuals
involved are bisexual?

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Some may I think what I've what
I've worked on for all this time

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is to create a a safe space with
a set of rules, social cues that

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whatever you're into.
And again, it's not my job to

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monitor what's going on in your
bedroom.

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But if you're looking for that
space where maybe you want to

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have a threesome with another
woman or another guy or some,

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you know, raging orgy or
polycule or whatever the

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complexity it is you're seeking,
there really isn't a lot of

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quality opportunities to do
that.

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I'm not saying quality people,
I'm saying quality spaces.

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There seems to be in this arena,
a rush to the bottom, a rush to

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focus on how many people you can
fit in the door for an event, a

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party, a cruise, as opposed to
the quality of the people, the

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quality of the venue and what's
going on.

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And that's, I think what's
differentiated the group from,

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you know, local clubs and
parties.

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And for those that are sticking
their toe into this for the

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first time, the initial thought
is I want to meet people

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one-on-one.
I'm going to maybe go to a

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website, try to find a couple or
try to find a single person

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that's going to, you know, fit
my relationship dynamic, my

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sexual appetite.
And people quickly learn that

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it's hard, you know, if you're
just, you know, one guy dating

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one girl, it's hard enough to
find a compatible partner.

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But when you start talking about
3 or 4 people meeting for the

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first time, you know how much,
no matter how much communication

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goes on ahead of time, it's not
uncommon to walk into that first

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meeting and go, Oh my gosh, that
person smokes.

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I forgot to ask that I hate
smokers.

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And so after a few, you know,
extended interactions where you

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finally get to meet somebody at
the local bar, restaurant, what

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have you, folks start looking
for an alternative, digging

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deeper into the websites,
digging deeper into, you know,

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whatever parties or events to
basically create a a speed

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dating situation.
And again the prop.

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Please go.
Ahead please.

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Now, as I say, this is the
challenge where you know, if

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you're in a small city, Kansas
City, Saint Louis, Boston, where

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your opportunities for these
type of events, clubs, parties

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is very limited.
It's not that you can't meet

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good quality people anywhere.
The challenge is doing it

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consistently.
And So what happens more than

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not is in these smaller cities
that have smaller opportunities,

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you know, that white collar
professional will show up once,

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look around and say, wow, not my
kind of place, not my kind of

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crowd, and then walk out never
to be seen again.

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So the folks that show up the
following week looking for that

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same white collar professional,
you know, are likely not to run

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into them.
And again, I'm talking about the

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the smaller cities in the US and
Canada.

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In the larger markets like New
York and Dallas, Miami, you have

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more opportunity, but that
doesn't necessarily mean you're

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attracting more quality
individuals.

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And when people hear about open
relationships, they sometimes

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assume it's only about sex.
From your perspective, what is

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the bigger picture?
That's a very interesting

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question.
It's, it's going to sound a

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little off at first.
Over time, as you know, you

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become comfortable identifying
as somebody who's in this ENM

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space.
You, you have a different type

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of friendship with the people
you meet.

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I'll give you a, a great example
in reverse.

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Men especially are a little bit
more closeted about their

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sexuality, their health, their
emotions than than women

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typically are.
But if I had a question about

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prostate, you know, exams, I
would more quickly reach out to

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one of my friends male friends
in the lifestyle than one of my

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vanilla friends elsewhere.
There is a level of trust that

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comes in this space that is both
necessary and a a really

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valuable benefit.
And I, and I would say let me

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put another context.
If I trust you to sleep with my

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wife and you don't screw that up
by texting her or emailing or

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doing some other weird nonsense
when I'm not looking, I will

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probably trust your personal
opinion, if not your

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professional opinion, and
possibly seek it out.

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And that's, that brings me to
the question of who participates

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in the lifestyle?
Are these primarily couples,

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singles or a mix?
And you know how?

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How does your community manage
that balance?

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First of all, it's definitely a
mix.

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I think that those who enjoy,
participate, look for, exist in

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a open relationship space or a
percentage of the population, no

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different than, you know,
there's a fixed percentage of

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people that are homosexual.
It's also very interesting,

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again, I've been doing this a
long time to watch folks who

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come into the space discover
that that is where they're

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happy.
That's their comfortable space

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for their relationship dynamic
and they continue for decades.

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That doesn't mean that they're,
you know, hooking up with people

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or going to clubs or going to
parties.

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But they identify as, oh, yeah,
I'm Polly, I'm open, I'm ENM,

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I'm a swinger or I'm in the
lifestyle, whatever, you know,

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adjective they want to use.
That doesn't change.

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And again, I would say, you
know, nobody hits age 30 and

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says, OK, I'm not gay anymore.
You know, once you've figured

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out you are, you are, and if
you're comfortable with it, you

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continue on, people will put it
on the shelf for a period of

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time.
You know, wife gets pregnant,

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you know, kids join traveling
sports.

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You know, you get older, then
you start getting, you know,

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elderly parents that have health
issues.

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And so I've watched over the
years people phase in and out.

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But again, I've known folks for
20 years that are, whether

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they're actively participating
or not, would still say, Oh

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yeah, no, we're definitely in
the lifestyle.

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But they haven't necessarily met
with anybody else.

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It could be for a year or two.
And you've, and you've been a

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part of this lifestyle for many
years.

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And what have you seen shifts
since, you know, since you got

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into it?
How has society, you know, is

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perceiving it?
Because I feel like this is

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becoming more and more of a
conversation.

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And again, just even having a
student in my course right now

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who dedicates her time.
She's happily married and she

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and her husband are in the
lifestyle and and she works with

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couples or individuals who are
interested in entering it or

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meeting someone and which I
think is much harder matchmaking

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practice than regular
matchmaking.

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I I would think to put the first
two people together is no more

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or less difficult than any other
facet of matchmaking.

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But I think that third person or
you know, trying to integrate

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more is a lot more challenging.
And again, I can just imagine as

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a matchmaker, you've now
introduced, you know, Bob to

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Sue, and Bob and Sue are both,
you know, interested in an open

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relationship.
And then they come back to the

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matchmaker and said, how do we
get to meet Carol?

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And I could see that would be,
you know, could be challenging,

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but for a matchmaker that's
building that database, maybe

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not so much.
Yeah.

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And as someone who's married,
what led you personally to

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explore?
I mean, you gave the background,

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but now you're in a
relationship, married.

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Did you have to talk your wife
into it?

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Was she into it?
Like how did?

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That oh, this is this is
actually rather amusing.

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So I was hosting a New Year's
event 2013.

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All the guests were staying at
the Ritz Carlton Club level in

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Fort Lauderdale.
We had New Year's was actually

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on a Tuesday similar to this
year.

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And so we had a whole weekend of
events, yachts and, you know,

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cabana parties at the Ritz and
Gloria Estevan's band.

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One night, The Wailers on New
Year's Eve, and somebody brought

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her as another couple said, oh,
we have a new friend, can we

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bring her as our guest?
And they sent me her photos and

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her name, and I said sure,
that'd be great.

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Let's just say it worked out
better for me than it did for

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them.
How long have you been married

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now?
We've been together since New

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Year.
Specifically, we'll, I'll I'll

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define it as New Year's Eve
2014, January 1st, so just over

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10 years.
That's amazing.

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I, I just want to break a quick
break for a commercial and we'll

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get right back to our
conversation.

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00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,160
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Back to our episode here.
What do you think are the

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00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:05,840
biggest misconceptions about
people in open relationships?

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00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:11,560
CD Trashy walking down the
hallway of the Ramada Inn with

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their Dick hanging out.
Sure.

236
00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:19,720
Yeah, I I agree.
I think that I think because

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00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:25,920
knowing people in the lifestyle
that are Uber wealthy, we were

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00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:32,480
talking about this earlier who
run amazing businesses and have

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00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:35,880
been married for many, many
years and they they are part of

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00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:38,520
the lifestyle.
And these are, you know,

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00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:43,200
upstanding citizens,
hardworking, employing a ton of

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00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:46,280
people similar to you.
I know you have like 70

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00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:51,600
employees and this just happens
to be a thing, right?

244
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,440
And I think people have a
misconception that you're

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00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:58,360
walking into some seedy place
that's dirty and dingy and has

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00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,320
stuff all over the place.
Well, that's, I mean, the truth

247
00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:06,280
is that's a lot.
And I again, we have a process

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00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:10,160
for filtering and vetting our,
our members that's long

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00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:13,720
established.
And one of the things that

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00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:17,920
happens regularly is I provide
an opportunity for, you know,

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00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:24,680
anyone before they come to their
first private dinner to reach

252
00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:29,440
out and have a phone call.
And the number of calls that

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00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:34,760
have gone the following my
partner, I walked into the club

254
00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:38,440
and she took one look at the
furniture and said I wouldn't

255
00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:40,320
sit on this furniture with my
clothes on.

256
00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:44,240
It's time to leave.
My partner and I walked into the

257
00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,760
club or the party or the cruise,
and then she took one look at

258
00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:49,920
the other people in the room and
said if we don't leave now, I'm

259
00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:54,000
never sleeping with you again.
One of the more memorable ones.

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00:16:56,080 --> 00:17:02,240
A gentleman called and said, my
wife graduated the CIA and we

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00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:05,160
walked into this party and she
saw this platter of sweaty

262
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:07,760
cheese and deli meat and
existed.

263
00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:11,839
We walk out and then the guy
complained about the price and I

264
00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:13,640
was still confused.
And I'm like, what is the

265
00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:16,560
central intelligent agent?
No, no, no, the Culinary

266
00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:19,000
Institute in Poughkeepsie.
And I'm like, oh, OK, makes a

267
00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:24,720
little more sense.
So there is a huge appetite for

268
00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:29,880
meeting your people, you know,
And I think that that's across

269
00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:31,760
the board.
Again, Roman orgies really were

270
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:34,120
Roman orgies.
That happened a long time ago.

271
00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:38,680
And since then, no one has found
any place new to stick anything

272
00:17:38,680 --> 00:17:41,680
different.
All those, all those things have

273
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:43,640
been figured out.
We're just the folks doing it

274
00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:47,680
now.
I had a a writer, a travel

275
00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:54,200
writer at the resort yesterday.
And I said, oh, well, you know,

276
00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,280
where, where were you recently?
And she told me about an

277
00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:59,280
interview she just did with a
airline CEO.

278
00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:07,760
And I said, oh, how is Dave?
And we talked for a few minutes,

279
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,000
of course, never telling him how
we knew each other or why.

280
00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:16,840
But it's really, really much
more common than I think those

281
00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,560
unindoctrinated, not
indoctrinated would, would

282
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,120
understand.
You know, I'm looking at

283
00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:33,680
websites similar to Match with,
you know, 100,000 members all

284
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:35,360
trying to figure out how to find
their people.

285
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:40,720
I had somebody that recently
recently provided me a list of

286
00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:44,760
everybody interested in the
lifestyle that had ever

287
00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:49,160
subscribed to a Facebook group
and it was 2.1 million.

288
00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:52,040
Yeah.
And I mean, This is why we're

289
00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:56,040
having this conversation because
I know that it comes up over and

290
00:18:56,040 --> 00:19:00,280
over again.
And I think that, you know,

291
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:05,560
people just have to be a little
bit more aware of what what's

292
00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,120
out there, what's available.
And that's part of what we want

293
00:19:08,120 --> 00:19:10,600
to bring to these.
Well, there's and, and there's,

294
00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:13,200
and I got to say there's,
there's, there's an intellectual

295
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:17,520
component to this too.
You know, again, monogamous

296
00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:23,520
relationships, you know, in
1925, how long did you live?

297
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,360
You know, how long were you in
fact married to your high school

298
00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:30,800
sweetheart before you died of
coronary disease or tuberculosis

299
00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:34,160
or whatever?
So folks are living longer.

300
00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:37,040
They are having second and third
marriages or they're looking at

301
00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:41,240
their first marriage going, OK,
how do we get this to, you know,

302
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:47,120
how do we get another 20 years?
And, you know, that lifestyle

303
00:19:47,120 --> 00:19:51,160
opportunity fosters something
that we're not talking about.

304
00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:58,440
To do this, it requires so much
conversation.

305
00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:01,840
And when I meet young couples
and I'm talking in their 20s and

306
00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:06,000
they're, you know, asking the
the wise old man about, you

307
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:09,520
know, how, how they should
pursue this, I look at the young

308
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:10,800
man.
I say, listen, here's the deal.

309
00:20:11,120 --> 00:20:15,760
Your girlfriend, your fiance,
your new bride is prepared to

310
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:19,920
let you sleep with other women.
That's the great news.

311
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:24,600
But for every hour of sex you're
going to go have with another

312
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:30,160
woman, it's going to take 100
hours of conversation with your

313
00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:34,040
partner of like true soul
searching, meaningful.

314
00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:36,880
Someone's going to get upset.
Someone's going to need a box of

315
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,720
tissue of conversation.
And and then I turn to the young

316
00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:44,520
woman.
I say you know you're about to

317
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:47,960
get 100 hours of conversation
out of your partner that he

318
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:49,880
might otherwise not be motivated
to have.

319
00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:56,120
And, and you, you often talk
about, you know, members that

320
00:20:56,120 --> 00:21:00,320
are sapiosexual because this is
not just about the sex, it's

321
00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:06,080
also about having meaningful
connections and conversations

322
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:10,080
and not just, it's just not
physical, not just physical,

323
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:11,320
right?
No.

324
00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:13,680
And the sapiosexual is a great,
a great reference.

325
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,840
Again, one of my favorite catch
phrases is, you know, there are

326
00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,680
folks in the lifestyle who are
looking for anonymous sex in a

327
00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:24,120
dark room with strangers.
And that's great.

328
00:21:24,120 --> 00:21:26,000
You know, everything, everything
is on a spectrum.

329
00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:29,440
But at the other end of that
spectrum are folks that think

330
00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:32,440
great sex starts between the
ears, not the thighs.

331
00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:37,440
And they want to be able to, you
know, have a conversation, hear

332
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,560
the response, flirt a little,
get to know you.

333
00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:45,680
And maybe that takes an evening
or a day or two days or a couple

334
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:48,320
of meetings on, you know,
multiple occasions.

335
00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:53,720
And that's really where the
group has thrived is it's those

336
00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:59,760
professionals, single coupled,
throttled, who want to hang out

337
00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:04,000
with their peers, enjoy the
bestest city has to offer and

338
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:08,600
venues and accommodations and
chefs and Grammy winners and

339
00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:11,800
James Beard winners and all the
rest and where sex is a

340
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,840
possibility.
It's an element of the weekend.

341
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:18,080
It's not the sole focus.
And that's what the group has

342
00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:22,480
been about for 20 years.
What's shifted is we've now

343
00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:26,640
started acquiring venues.
So we bought our first private

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00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,160
first resort and we're taking a
private right now.

345
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:34,640
So in the coming weeks, you'll
be a member in order to get even

346
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,840
get on the property and even to
be a member.

347
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:39,840
It's not something you can pay
to do.

348
00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:42,160
It's not something you can sign
up for.

349
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:46,360
There's a vetting process and it
requires us meeting you in

350
00:22:46,360 --> 00:22:52,720
person at a dinner in one of 70
cities, from Mexico City to

351
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,040
Berlin.
Yeah, I was.

352
00:22:55,120 --> 00:22:57,880
I was going to say, tell me more
about this vetting process for

353
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,840
anyone who's listening, who's
interested in joining your

354
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,960
group.
Well, again, you can show up at

355
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,200
any local club on a Friday,
Saturday night.

356
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:09,640
There's probably 100 of them in
the United States.

357
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,160
They're typically in the light
industrial parks or in some

358
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:16,160
seedy neighborhood where zoning
hasn't caught up with what

359
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:20,240
they're doing.
And then there's the group.

360
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:24,640
And so there is a, an invitation
or application process, our

361
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:29,120
staff reviews it, does all the,
the online research necessary

362
00:23:29,120 --> 00:23:32,400
and makes that initial decision
whether we're going to invite

363
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:34,240
you to an event called just for
dinner.

364
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:37,080
And again, we do that from
Vancouver to Miami.

365
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:43,080
I mean, we, it's 70 cities
around the world and at every

366
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:47,000
one of those dinners in every
city, and there's about 90 a

367
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,080
year is either myself or my
wife.

368
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:56,640
And we're there on our own or
with, with each other meeting

369
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,600
everyone.
And, you know, the phrase

370
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,400
catfishing doesn't need to be
defined any further than it has

371
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:04,800
been, but that's part of it.
You know, when you're hosting an

372
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:07,920
event, you want to make sure
everybody is going to have a

373
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:09,960
good time.
That's your goal is the host.

374
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:16,600
And so that's issue #1 are you
going to be a good fit socially

375
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:21,280
for an event?
You know, is it a weekend at the

376
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:24,440
Saint Regis in Aspen?
Is it, you know, something at

377
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:29,800
The Four Seasons in Sonoma or
Encore in Vegas, where, where

378
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:35,400
ever we're going, I'm looking
for folks who understand the

379
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:41,400
social cues and are going to be
a good fit, who you're attracted

380
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:44,280
to.
I'm not going to try to figure

381
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,160
that out, but I know if I stock
the room full of people who are

382
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:51,400
well read, well spoken,
respectful, well traveled, I'm

383
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:54,080
well on my path to finding
somebody you're going to be

384
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,600
interested in.
Can you define for the folks

385
00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:03,120
that are listening and curious?
You know, there's so many terms

386
00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:07,800
out there like we know ethical,
non monogamy, polyamory, open

387
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,040
relations, like what are all
these different terms that

388
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:14,960
perhaps you can go through as
many as you can to help.

389
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,760
I I honestly I see them as
generational.

390
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:22,400
OK.
I think of boomers as swingers.

391
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,240
It's sort of shorthand for the
whole space.

392
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:30,160
But again, thinking back to that
group of adults that were adults

393
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,840
before there was an Internet.
And so to meet your partner,

394
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:38,360
your Playmate or your, you know,
whatever you were looking in the

395
00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:41,480
back of newspapers and
magazines, getting a post office

396
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,640
box, buying a Polaroid camera,
you know, e-mail, not emailing,

397
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,760
you know, literally mailing, you
know, letters back and forth

398
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:50,360
until you finally decided to
meet.

399
00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:53,240
So it was hard.
It was difficult.

400
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,120
There was a lot of time and
energy invested.

401
00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:57,840
And I'm sure there was a lot of
flakes and frauds in the

402
00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:59,560
process.
For Gen.

403
00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:02,280
X.
We've had the Internet for as

404
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,320
long as we've been adults.
You can find anything on the

405
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:07,480
Internet.
You can find Nazis in

406
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:09,680
Charlottesville, VA, if you're
so inclined.

407
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:14,440
And so the ability to find other
people who are interested in

408
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,360
open relationships.
I mean, there's a long list of

409
00:26:19,360 --> 00:26:21,680
adult websites.
Adult Friend Finder was an early

410
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,320
one.
SDC is a more popular one, more

411
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:28,400
contemporary, but there's a list
and they're, you know,

412
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:32,240
different, different ones are
popular in different cities and

413
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:33,840
different markets around the
world.

414
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:36,640
And it varies, you know, from
city to city and country to

415
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:39,360
country.
So Gen.

416
00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:43,280
X has always been able to find a
party, find a cruise, finds a

417
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:47,040
club to go to, but that didn't
mean that you were looking for

418
00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:48,880
for quality.
And so for Gen.

419
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,040
X, it became the lifestyle,
right?

420
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,920
Have a cocktail, go to a club,
meet somebody.

421
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:55,520
What do you like?
You like peanut butter in your

422
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:56,960
hair?
Fine, that's not my kink.

423
00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:59,640
You have a nice night and you
kind of go your separate ways

424
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:07,640
and meet the next person.
Millennials had parents that

425
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,360
were at least if you're in this
space, we're typically a bit

426
00:27:11,360 --> 00:27:14,360
more open, right?
If there was a neighbor running

427
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:19,320
a, a pride flag on the front of
their house, you know, when I'm

428
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:22,040
sitting with millennials, the
conversation is more like, oh,

429
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:24,560
yeah, no, my parents were
completely cool with it.

430
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,840
And you know, the the gay couple
on the street, they were great.

431
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:31,960
And my parents said, you know,
it's not our thing, but it's

432
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:33,240
fine that that's what they're
into.

433
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:38,000
And so when I meet millennials,
it's not about how, you know,

434
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:41,800
again, boomers, it's about how
quick can we get to penetration

435
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,320
because it took so long to get
there.

436
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:49,480
Gen.
X, there were code words, full

437
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:56,520
swap, soft swap, socially by by
curious, all these things that

438
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,920
ultimately, even though we were
meeting socially, we were

439
00:27:59,920 --> 00:28:03,120
queuing up for some sort of
sexual interaction.

440
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:08,080
Millennials all of a sudden came
along and they're like, well,

441
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,840
we're not swingers and we're not
lifestyle, but we're ethically

442
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,960
non monogamous, consensual, you
know, etcetera.

443
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,200
And so when I sit at dinner with
with these folks, the

444
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,160
conversation is more about we're
looking for the person or

445
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:24,400
persons that fit our ideal
relationship dynamic.

446
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,680
In other words, you know, we're
looking for somebody to move

447
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:29,280
into our bed.
We're looking for somebody to

448
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:31,800
move into our spare bedroom.
We're looking for somebody that

449
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,760
we only see once a month, once a
week, once a quarter or never

450
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,480
again.
For them, there's no question

451
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,640
about whether they'll have sex.
The question is, does the

452
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,080
relationship fit?
Right.

453
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:50,080
I, I would imagine that there's
a lot of jealousy triggers,

454
00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:54,160
situations and behaviors that
tend to spark like a lot, you

455
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:57,320
know, jealousy or insecurity.
How do you manage that?

456
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,480
One of the things that I'll, and
again, I usually had meet people

457
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:06,560
that are a little further in
their journey.

458
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:11,160
They're either north of 40.
They've had these conversations,

459
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,280
they've been talking about it
for a while.

460
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,600
They're now maybe they've been
to one or two things that are

461
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:17,640
looking for the thing that fits
them.

462
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:24,280
If I have one piece of advice
for a couple that's already

463
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:28,200
coupled and they're going to
explore the spaces before you

464
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:32,840
walk in anywhere, anywhere, even
if you're just going to go to

465
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:37,000
the like local, you know, corner
bar and think it's going to be

466
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,960
fun to cruise for 1/3 to join
you tonight.

467
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,440
Once you've figured out what
you're looking for, what you

468
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,040
want to do and what the
boundaries are like, OK, if we

469
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:54,160
meet somebody tonight, we can do
this, but not that fine.

470
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,080
When you all that is sorted out
and before you walk through the

471
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:02,000
door of wherever you're going,
the second conversation you need

472
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:06,000
to have is what are we going to
do when one of us wants to break

473
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,400
the rules?
And I'll give you a great

474
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,840
example.
In those original parties 20

475
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:17,240
years ago, I was I was dating a
woman and she went upstairs with

476
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:21,240
another couple and they were
things were getting hot and

477
00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,360
heavy.
And at some point the gentleman

478
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:27,840
turned to my girlfriend and
said, OK, yeah, or the I'm

479
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:28,960
sorry.
My girlfriend turned to the

480
00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:32,720
gentleman and said, you know,
take me and he looks to his

481
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:35,360
fiance and says, would that be
OK?

482
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:40,760
Now, speaking as a guy, I'm
telling you right now, I think

483
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,640
I've completely checked all the
boxes when I've turned to you

484
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:46,920
and asked that question, 'cause
I'm a guy and there's a blonde

485
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,440
in front of me with her, you
know, knees spread.

486
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,160
The fiance runs downstairs,
finds me and breaks, burst into

487
00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:01,080
tears because they had had that
conversation about what the

488
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,720
boundaries were going to be on
this first party on this first

489
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,960
night, and their rule was no
penetration.

490
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:13,240
So the fact that he now wanted
to break the rules and did so in

491
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,600
front of her and again asked in
front of her, which he thought

492
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,080
was being very conscientious,
did not go over well.

493
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:23,960
So my advice there is have those
conversations.

494
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:25,960
Where are the boundaries for
tonight?

495
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:28,880
What's acceptable, what's not
acceptable?

496
00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:33,480
And what are we going to do when
you've had, you know, 4 bourbons

497
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:37,360
and want to, you know, shift the
shift the line?

498
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,320
Yeah, I've heard that there's a
term that is often used called

499
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:47,400
veto, and that is the rule that
lets one partner cancel another

500
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:52,080
partner's relationship or plans,
which is commonly used with the

501
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:57,680
E&M folks to avoid any problems.
And that there's a lot of

502
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:02,280
conversation around boundaries,
a lot of disclosure, and

503
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:08,440
everything has to be consensual.
Absolutely, absolutely.

504
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:13,440
And it's very interesting to see
as you go again from from

505
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:17,240
Boomers to Gen.
Z, how much that emphasis

506
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:20,520
changes.
Again, I hear, I hear feedback

507
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:25,320
regularly from, you know, other
gathering places where, you

508
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:28,000
know, this whole guy came up to
me and took one look at me and

509
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:30,520
said, hey, do you want to go in
the back and fuck?

510
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,440
And I looked at him and said, do
you want to know my name?

511
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,240
He said no.
He said, you know, again, kind

512
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:44,040
of a behavior I associate more
with Boomers who just came up

513
00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:46,000
being more abrupt about what
we're here to fuck.

514
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,040
We're here for the penetration.
That's why we went through all

515
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,240
this effort.
Gen.

516
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:53,640
Z, again, is a completely
different thing.

517
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:58,160
And for them, you know, again,
the group had a camp at Burning

518
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:01,600
Man for years.
And there are the 10 principles

519
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:06,320
of Burning Man and the 11th
principle, and it's referred to

520
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:08,840
as the 11th principle, is
consent.

521
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:14,080
Yeah.
Let me ask you about this.

522
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,840
This is the first thing that
comes to mind for me, 'cause I'm

523
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:20,680
a germaphobe.
So I think about health safety

524
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:25,600
private course.
How do you navigate that safe

525
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,960
sex testing cadence you?
Know, you know, it's, it's very

526
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:36,800
interesting when you there.
I, I know of specifically a a

527
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:40,640
party host that does events in
New York and LA focused on Gen.

528
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:45,960
Z and millennials and they have
a testing requirement that you

529
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,960
have to have an STD test.
It has to be in so many weeks.

530
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:54,080
And, you know, on you go.
At the same time, you know, I

531
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,920
mentioned my friend Dave that
runs an airline I've never seen

532
00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:00,120
without a Sport coat on at every
event.

533
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:01,640
He's got a Sport coat on every
event.

534
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:04,920
Do I know that he and his his
wife hook up with people?

535
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,320
Yeah, because his wife is
friends with my wife and I hear

536
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:11,679
about it after the fact.
But again, let people be in

537
00:34:11,679 --> 00:34:17,320
their comfort level and
recognize that again, there are

538
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,600
those folks who are looking for
anonymous sex in a dark room

539
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:21,639
with strangers and yeah, that's
important.

540
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,480
And then there are the other end
of the folks that are looking

541
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:32,199
for a long term relationship.
So I want to talk more about

542
00:34:32,199 --> 00:34:36,040
what you're doing, You know, the
different options that you're

543
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:39,239
providing.
I know you have the group and

544
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:43,000
you don't now have the resort.
So let's tell me, tell us about

545
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:45,159
the resort.
What makes it different and how

546
00:34:45,159 --> 00:34:49,679
does it serve as a safe and
upscale alternative to people in

547
00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:53,239
the lifestyle?
And we're not the resort.

548
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:58,280
That was, you know, the resort
that somebody recently died and

549
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:00,240
left.
You know, we're talking where is

550
00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:02,560
this resort?
What part of the world is it in?

551
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:08,000
So we are in Jamaica and Jamaica
is a small country, so I'm going

552
00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:13,880
to leave it right there.
And again, we started by

553
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:20,360
acquiring an existing five star
property with the single goal of

554
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:25,120
elevating the property.
You know, again, anytime you buy

555
00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:27,040
something, I don't care if it's
a car or a house, you're going

556
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:30,960
to put, you know, your touches
on it and then take it private.

557
00:35:31,240 --> 00:35:34,600
And so for those listeners who
are familiar with the Soho House

558
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:39,560
hotels, which is, I think the
first hotel group that proved

559
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:43,520
you can have a private hotel
chain similar to a private, you

560
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:48,280
know, Country Club or golf
course, one of my best skills is

561
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,520
plagiarism.
I'll go on the record saying

562
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:53,240
that.
And so we're borrowing very

563
00:35:53,240 --> 00:35:55,880
heavily from Soho House's format
now.

564
00:35:55,880 --> 00:36:00,080
Their target audience
historically has been folks in

565
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:04,480
the creative arts, writers,
actresses, influencers.

566
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,080
Obviously, our focus is more for
those, you know, professionals

567
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:10,120
and some form of open
relationship.

568
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:17,600
And so just that simple.
Take a boutique property, put

569
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:20,560
new gates on the front, and if
you're not a member, you're not

570
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:25,120
getting through because there
are existing lifestyle

571
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,720
properties.
There's one in Jamaica called

572
00:36:27,720 --> 00:36:30,680
Hedonism 2.
There was never a Hedonism one.

573
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,520
They thought they'd start with
two because it'd be clever.

574
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:37,240
And they're celebrating their
49th year.

575
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:41,560
There's a property in Mexico
called Desire.

576
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:44,720
It's again been around for a
long time.

577
00:36:44,720 --> 00:36:50,080
It's a little nicer then the
then the one in Jamaica and then

578
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:54,320
they opened a second property
called Pearl and that's it.

579
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,920
But again, we sit at these
client dinners, member dinners,

580
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,600
week in, week out with the
feedback in, you know, every

581
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:07,560
city and secondary city in North
America and we hear the same

582
00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:08,680
thing.
Wouldn't it be great if there

583
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:11,720
was a five star lifestyle
property, you know, for the

584
00:37:11,720 --> 00:37:16,720
folks that are comfortable at
the Montage Auberge Aman St.

585
00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:22,480
Regis, what have you.
And my sentiment is, yes, we can

586
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:27,480
create a five star hotel
situation.

587
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:33,120
However, if we were building a
Four Seasons, there would be a

588
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:37,160
standard checklist, fit, finish,
service and all the things that

589
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,040
we're familiar with.
However, to do a lifestyle

590
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:44,920
property, I think that's only
48% of the equation.

591
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,000
The other 52% is who you're
going to meet at the pool.

592
00:37:49,240 --> 00:37:52,920
The only way to do that is to
screen those people to curate

593
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,200
those invitations, which is what
the group has been doing for 20

594
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,720
years.
And so to go to the resort, you

595
00:37:59,720 --> 00:38:03,600
have to be a member or be
invited or how does that?

596
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:04,720
Work.
Yeah.

597
00:38:04,720 --> 00:38:07,320
So you would have to be the
guest of an existing member,

598
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,160
which if you don't know, I'm not
going to tell you who they are.

599
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:17,480
Or you would have to go to our
website, look at our calendar,

600
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,560
find a dinner coming up in a
city near you.

601
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:27,160
And these are typically 5 course
dinners with wine pairings in

602
00:38:27,160 --> 00:38:29,800
the private dining room of
whatever the best restaurants

603
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:34,920
are in town, James Beard,
Michelin, etcetera.

604
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:40,720
And we meet at those dinners the
folks that have tried the local

605
00:38:40,720 --> 00:38:46,000
scene and not found their
people, the folks that have got

606
00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:50,000
a tremendous investment in their
career and are concerned about

607
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,480
their privacy.
So they're not going to go to

608
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:57,240
the local club in fear of
running into their kids, teacher

609
00:38:57,240 --> 00:39:01,680
or the janitor from their, you
know, place of employment or

610
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,840
what have you.
And then we have folks that

611
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:08,160
regularly fly in.
We've done dinners in different

612
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,160
cities where no one was local.
Everyone had flown in for the

613
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:14,120
dinner.
Again, concerned about privacy.

614
00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:18,960
Yeah.
Is that the justfordinner.com?

615
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,160
Website Thank you for thank you
for the plug.

616
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,160
Yeah.
And so that what it the way this

617
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:30,480
started, quite honestly was I
think we mentioned earlier, I, I

618
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:32,600
met a young woman and she said
this would be a great place for

619
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,400
a party.
And, you know, props to my mom.

620
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,560
I learned what I did for, you
know, learn from her how to

621
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:39,280
throw a party.
I hired a good caterer.

622
00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:43,200
I got a band from the city and I
invited people I wanted to hang

623
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:47,880
out with.
So 20 years later, we're still,

624
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,080
you know, I'm still friends with
some of those same folks.

625
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:59,360
And what's again, the longevity
of this is, you know, again, if

626
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:01,480
you're gay, you don't turn 30
and you stop being gay.

627
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:05,560
If you're in a relationship and
at some point you and your

628
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:09,080
partner decide we like having an
open relationship, whatever that

629
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:11,640
means.
Hot wiping, cuckold, threesomes,

630
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:14,720
foursomes, polycules, whatever
your dynamic is.

631
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:18,040
That's fine.
And it typically just doesn't

632
00:40:18,040 --> 00:40:21,520
evaporate over time.
You may phase in and out as, you

633
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:25,680
know, life gets in the way.
But I think once you identify

634
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,040
that this is your happy place,
it's where you keep coming back

635
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:33,960
to as as time allows.
So for us, after those first few

636
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:37,440
parties, I had a friend, we're
still friends.

637
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:40,320
He said, hey, let's go to Deer
Valley skiing.

638
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:42,760
And do you think you could do
one of those parties?

639
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,800
And so we invited our East Coast
friends and we met some broken

640
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,640
Mormons and we did the first
party.

641
00:40:49,720 --> 00:40:52,440
And then a few months later,
it's like, let's go to Hilton

642
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:54,680
Head and play golf.
And do you think you could do

643
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:57,400
one of those parties?
And so in pretty short order,

644
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:02,080
the group became, this became
kind of a travelling lifestyle

645
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:04,800
group.
And so whether it was, you know,

646
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:10,320
the Porsche track in Atlanta or
wineries in Sonoma and Napa, you

647
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:12,880
know, the Yacht show in Palm
Beach or something in

648
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:17,000
Wellington, that's where the
group started to congregate.

649
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,160
And so it was always a different
city, a different theme, a

650
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:25,720
different, you know, topic.
And because of the, you know,

651
00:41:25,720 --> 00:41:31,520
and we do 3 or 4 a year, it was
never clicky, right?

652
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:35,840
That was the best part.
It was always, you know, oh, are

653
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:36,720
you into this?
Great.

654
00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:38,520
Well, then we'll see you here.
And again, the people who would

655
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:42,840
go to Burning Man is a very
different crowd than the folks

656
00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,000
who want to go to equestrian
events at Wellington.

657
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:50,120
And and what is the difference
between the group and the

658
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,040
resort?
Are they the?

659
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:53,040
Same.
Membership.

660
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:55,040
Or can they have different types
of memberships?

661
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:57,840
Yeah.
So in order to have access to

662
00:41:57,840 --> 00:41:59,880
the resort, you have to be a
member of the group.

663
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:04,480
OK, pretty straightforward.
And somebody said, well, why do

664
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:06,920
you call it the resort?
I said very simply because I

665
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:08,800
don't want you to Google it.
I don't want people standing

666
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:12,120
outside the door looking to see
who's coming in and out.

667
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:16,640
Which of course is the reason
why we're doing this.

668
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:21,360
And we had this conversation
where you wanted your anonymity

669
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:24,600
because if people recognize you,
they're going to recognize you

670
00:42:24,600 --> 00:42:26,200
when you're having an event
somewhere.

671
00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:29,520
And there are celebrities and
high net worth individuals that

672
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:33,640
are part of your group, and so
we're respecting their privacy.

673
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:36,600
That and that's exactly right.
If I, if, if I'm recognized from

674
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:41,400
this podcast and I walk into the
private dining room with Dave,

675
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:45,120
the airline's CEO, all of a
sudden people are going to go

676
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,000
like, wait, is that Dave with
George?

677
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:49,560
And trust me, it's happened.
It's why we've adopted this

678
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,880
policy.
No total totally understood and

679
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:57,680
you know this is an esoteric
topic for some people that.

680
00:42:57,720 --> 00:42:59,920
Are and I and I want to, and I
want to touch on something that

681
00:42:59,920 --> 00:43:03,120
we haven't, we haven't touched
on yet.

682
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:06,960
There's another and it's very
strange.

683
00:43:06,960 --> 00:43:12,040
There's the good and bad of the
following topic.

684
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:21,040
We have absolutely met folks
who, you know, somebody got

685
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:25,600
caught cheating, maybe both
cheated and they decided they

686
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:29,200
were going to try to patch it up
and put things together again.

687
00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:32,920
And somewhere somebody
suggested, oh, let's try the

688
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:35,840
lifestyle and maybe we can,
instead of being, you know,

689
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,400
monogamous like we were supposed
to be for the last 20 years,

690
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:40,600
maybe we can be a little bit
more flexible on that.

691
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:48,440
Another variation of that which
I think is even definitely for

692
00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:52,760
people who are not as emotional
as I am, are the folks that are

693
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:55,880
like it's a preservation of
capital issue.

694
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,360
It's.
Cheaper to keep them.

695
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:02,760
Well, it's cheaper it, it's
cheaper to stay together.

696
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:05,080
And I have, and again, I have, I
can think of some friends right

697
00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:10,000
now, you know, they're from the
northeast.

698
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:14,880
They have a, a beautiful 2nd
house on one of the barrier

699
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:17,240
islands off the South Carolina
coast.

700
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:23,800
And she has a boyfriend, he has
a girlfriend, they've got kids

701
00:44:24,240 --> 00:44:29,200
and they have overlapping orbits
and sometimes they're four

702
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:31,720
people, sometimes it's two
people, sometimes it's 2:00 and

703
00:44:31,720 --> 00:44:34,400
2:00.
And they, they have a way that

704
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:40,400
works for them.
And so I don't try to define

705
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:46,520
your version of non monogamy.
I just try to find a space

706
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:51,120
that's both on the level you're
comfortable and with the people

707
00:44:51,120 --> 00:44:54,880
you want to associate with.
You know, this reminds me of a

708
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:57,680
story.
I was my husband and I were at a

709
00:44:57,680 --> 00:45:02,320
brewery and this couple walks in
and we usually sit at the bar.

710
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:06,600
So we're chatting and she was
like a high level executive in

711
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:11,360
the Pharmaceutical industry.
And he, he was a little bit

712
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,280
younger and had a different type
of career.

713
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:16,440
I forget.
I think he was like a, he worked

714
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:18,600
in the meat department or
something at a supermarket.

715
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:23,760
And so as we're chatting and of
course people always ask each

716
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:26,640
other, what do you do?
So I said at the time that I

717
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:30,120
was, you know, I, I taught
matchmaking and, and they were

718
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:32,360
like matchmaking.
And so he turns around and says

719
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:36,480
to me, I'm a pineapple.
And he says I'm actually an

720
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:39,520
upside down pineapple.
I have no idea what the heck

721
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,800
he's talking about.
Later on, I learned that

722
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:45,280
pineapples represent the
lifestyle.

723
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,720
And if it's upside down, that
means they're seeking someone.

724
00:45:47,720 --> 00:45:51,680
And then she finally said
something that clued me into

725
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:53,800
that.
It was a lifestyle thing.

726
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:55,600
And then I was like, oh, OK, I
think I know what they're

727
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:58,000
talking about.
And she's like, oh, this saved

728
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,560
our marriage.
I mean, we were, you know, it

729
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:02,240
was just going to be so
challenging.

730
00:46:02,240 --> 00:46:04,760
And of course, I'm never
judgmental when I'm having

731
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:08,000
conversations with people at at
former matchmaker.

732
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:11,280
If my ears haven't bled yet,
they never will.

733
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:15,160
I've heard it all.
But I think that my non

734
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:20,480
judgmental behavior sort of made
her think that that there was

735
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:25,960
any shot in hell because I mean,
honestly, not to be, you know,

736
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:28,400
looks matter, right?
And so these people were not

737
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:31,840
attractive at all.
And I was like, Oh my God, I'm

738
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,240
not in the lifestyle.
And if I were, you guys would

739
00:46:34,240 --> 00:46:35,920
not be the people that would
choose.

740
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:37,960
But anyway, she's like, here's
my number.

741
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,600
We have to hang out and here and
like really pushy.

742
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:43,360
And I'm like, Oh, and when you
were telling the story about how

743
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:46,480
people who are in the lifestyle
have a hard time meeting people

744
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,040
and then the machinations that
they must have to go through to

745
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:53,360
meet other people if they're if
they don't belong to a club like

746
00:46:53,360 --> 00:46:57,080
this or, you know, because
that's, that's kind of what it

747
00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:00,840
was, you know, in that scenario.
And we bought, you know, by the

748
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:03,320
end, by the end of the night, it
was like, I'm talking to my

749
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:05,520
husband, Warren.
And of course, he had no idea

750
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:08,480
what the hell was going on.
Like Warren, you, you know.

751
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:14,680
Or so or so he says, but go on.
Well, no, he he honestly did

752
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:15,720
not.
He had no clue.

753
00:47:15,720 --> 00:47:19,560
And I, I didn't know about the
symbolism with pineapples

754
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:21,320
either.
I mean, is this something that

755
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:25,440
you'd obviously.
That's actually very recent in

756
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:29,120
the last two or three years
really since COVID, I've seen it

757
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:35,600
take off strangely enough, you
know, in the 2000s into the

758
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:40,120
teens, especially for the
Eastern seaboard.

759
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:42,560
The phrase was do you know
George?

760
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:46,680
George?
No, similar similar to like, you

761
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:49,400
know, an alcoholic saying to a
bartender, no thank you.

762
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:54,040
I'm a friend of Bill's.
It, it became a, a code word

763
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:57,480
that was kind of flattering for
a while, quite honestly.

764
00:47:57,480 --> 00:48:00,880
But it was, it was time to take
the focus off of me and put it

765
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:04,120
really on what it should be,
which is the group, you know,

766
00:48:04,240 --> 00:48:06,520
not my ability to plagiarize
good parties.

767
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:14,200
Oh my God that is so funny.
Your your experience is really,

768
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:19,560
really common and I think that a
lot of your listeners, if they

769
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:24,760
start paying attention when they
go out to the local, you know,

770
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:28,200
popular watering hole, whatever
that is.

771
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:32,560
You know, it's the the Friday
night after drinks at the, you

772
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:35,680
know, the bar overlooking the
harbor.

773
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:38,000
Hopefully you have a harbor
where you live.

774
00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:43,480
You'll start seeing, you'll
start seeing that behavior of,

775
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:46,840
you know, maybe that couple
moving from, you know, one

776
00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:51,840
person to a next.
And it, it does there, there's

777
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:53,520
some absolutely some telltale
signs.

778
00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:57,800
There's another one that comes
up too, which is, and I know

779
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:02,920
this is a, a clue for a lot of
couples who are concerned about

780
00:49:04,720 --> 00:49:07,040
if their partner is cheating.
And I'm sure as a matchmaker,

781
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:10,480
you've heard this before, which
is I noticed my partner started

782
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:13,280
buying new underwear.
Have you ever heard that before?

783
00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:15,880
Well, no, actually have not
heard.

784
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:17,680
That well, that's always, that's
always the, that's always like

785
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:20,400
the first clue, right?
If your, if your husband, wife

786
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:24,200
of you know, 1020 years starts
buying new underwear, starts

787
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:27,280
joining the gym, then
something's up.

788
00:49:27,280 --> 00:49:30,440
Why, why are they doing that?
That's so interesting.

789
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:34,280
Now we'll bring in a divorce
attorney in for the next call.

790
00:49:36,040 --> 00:49:40,120
And, and what's interesting is
for couples in the lifestyle,

791
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:46,840
they turn that around with a
full 180 right now.

792
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:51,720
It goes from being that doughy
40 year old to you both have a

793
00:49:51,720 --> 00:49:54,720
gym membership and you're both
updating your wardrobe.

794
00:49:54,800 --> 00:50:03,480
And there's a what's the word
I'm thinking of where you find

795
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:05,600
where you find joy in your
partner's pleasure.

796
00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:11,760
Yeah, I mean, that is
interesting how that residual

797
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:18,720
effect of I, I, I also, I would
equate that sometimes with gay

798
00:50:18,720 --> 00:50:22,880
men tend to be that way,
especially because I know a lot

799
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:26,120
of gay men who have open
relationships and they go to the

800
00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:28,760
gym and they take care of
themselves and they, you know,

801
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:33,000
they do all the things, wardrobe
everything to look fabulous

802
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,960
because it's very common in the
community.

803
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:39,640
But also because these
particular people that I know

804
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:42,760
are in open relationships, even
though they're in a committed

805
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,160
relationship.
Well, it's funny.

806
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:47,840
It's funny you mention gay
because I, you know, the

807
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:53,760
conference that we may have met
at is the the GDI Global Dating

808
00:50:53,760 --> 00:51:00,120
Insights Conference.
And I was at one recently and

809
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,920
met the founder of Grinder
gentleman by the name of Joel.

810
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:08,160
And Joel sold out for, you know,
a tremendous amount of money.

811
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:14,160
He had a multi year non compete
and he travelled as a gay man

812
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:16,320
with a almost unlimited bank
account would.

813
00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:19,240
And I met him at this conference
and he was starting to launch a

814
00:51:19,240 --> 00:51:20,640
new site.
And we chatted afterwards.

815
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:26,840
I said, you know, in all your
travels, is there a five star

816
00:51:26,840 --> 00:51:30,600
property dedicated to a gay
audience?

817
00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:32,840
He said absolutely not.
He said, you know, there's some

818
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:36,200
cruises, there's some parties in
Ibiza, but there's not a single

819
00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:39,000
place.
And I said, well, what if there

820
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:41,000
was a gay version of the Soho
House?

821
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:45,800
And he handed me his phone
number because the, the, and

822
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,920
again, I have, I have female
female couples in the group.

823
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:55,200
I have a few male male couples
in the group because again, the

824
00:51:55,240 --> 00:52:00,840
offerings are so limited.
One of my good friends, you

825
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:03,080
know, both have sons.
These are two women.

826
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:04,760
They both have sons.
They've both been married

827
00:52:04,760 --> 00:52:06,840
before.
At a certain point, they just

828
00:52:06,840 --> 00:52:10,840
decided they were sick of men,
loved each other, got married.

829
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:14,480
I was at the wedding.
And you know that little

830
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:17,560
something that they're missing
that a guy can provide, They

831
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:19,400
were able to find it in the
group when they needed it.

832
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:27,200
This is this has been an
incredible conversation and just

833
00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:34,960
a lot for people to take in and
learn because this is what's out

834
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:38,200
there, right?
And George, your community, your

835
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:44,880
insights can all be found on the
group the-group.co, correct?

836
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,800
And it's a resource hub and A
blog with thoughtful content for

837
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:52,560
professionals navigating the
open lifestyle.

838
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:56,680
George, thank you so much for
joining me today and sharing

839
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,280
your expertise.
I know our audience of

840
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:03,280
matchmakers and relationship
professionals will gain a lot of

841
00:53:03,280 --> 00:53:06,960
valuable perspective on how to
navigate and better serve

842
00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:11,200
clients in this evolving space.
Because often you know, I've

843
00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:14,400
recommended matchmakers to even
add a question in their

844
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:20,040
questionnaire to have this be
another option for them.

845
00:53:21,240 --> 00:53:24,440
And to all the listeners, don't
forget to subscribe to the

846
00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:28,880
matchmaker podcasts on Apple,
Spotify or your favorite

847
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:31,120
platform.
And if you know someone who

848
00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:34,400
should be a guest on the show or
you're interested in becoming a

849
00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:38,000
matchmaker, check us out at the
love Pro mastermind.com.

850
00:53:39,120 --> 00:53:42,320
George, any last words you would
like to share with the with the

851
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:45,040
audience before we?
Arlene, I think for your

852
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:47,600
matchmakers that question is not
optional.

853
00:53:47,600 --> 00:53:49,320
I think it's required.
Yeah.

854
00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:52,160
I think that for those folks,
especially those that are

855
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:56,280
looking for their second
marriage, second long term

856
00:53:56,280 --> 00:54:00,800
committed relationship, the
people that I meet a lot of the

857
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:03,040
time are just looking for
something, you know, they've

858
00:54:03,040 --> 00:54:07,200
established their career, their
their cribs, they're sorry,

859
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:10,120
their their children are, you
know, old enough that they can

860
00:54:10,120 --> 00:54:13,560
have daycare or nannies or
travel with them, etcetera.

861
00:54:14,120 --> 00:54:19,360
And so they're looking for a
different tone to their next

862
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,400
relationship, a different
lightness, that ability to

863
00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:25,400
travel and just have fun.
I met I met a woman yesterday

864
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:29,720
who said, I've got a partner, I
travel for a living.

865
00:54:29,720 --> 00:54:31,200
He doesn't want to leave the
couch.

866
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:36,720
And so she's, you know, there's
an engagement ring and she's

867
00:54:36,720 --> 00:54:39,480
ready to hand it back.
I think that that's a really

868
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:43,480
important sentiment for folks
that are at that point

869
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:47,480
economically that they're
employing, engaging a matchmaker

870
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:51,920
is matchmaker should absolutely
ask that question because

871
00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:56,360
they're already getting fed this
content, whether it's on cable

872
00:54:56,360 --> 00:55:00,960
TV or social media or TikTok.
You know, this stuff is coming

873
00:55:00,960 --> 00:55:03,240
at them every day.
And even if they haven't done

874
00:55:03,240 --> 00:55:07,200
it, they're at least aware of it
and possibly thinking about it.

875
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:11,560
Yeah, no, I agree.
I I in a recent newsletter, I

876
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:15,880
express that matchmaker should
be asking these questions to not

877
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:19,640
be afraid to cover topics about
sex because that's part of

878
00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:22,080
compatibility.
And in some cases, there are

879
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:27,320
people who are maybe closeted
and are open to relationships

880
00:55:27,320 --> 00:55:30,120
with the same sex.
And it's become increasingly

881
00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:34,360
difficult in our world today
with so many people lonely, so

882
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:39,280
many people not in a happy and
healthy relationship, that if

883
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:44,560
you are mentally prepared to be
open about that, maybe there are

884
00:55:44,560 --> 00:55:47,440
people who are of the same sex
that are a good match for you.

885
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:52,800
And you've been, you know,
presenting yourself as a

886
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:55,680
heterosexual, but maybe you
would be happy.

887
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:59,480
So I just think that for
matchmaking, we need to always

888
00:55:59,480 --> 00:56:04,240
have an open mind, not judge and
and allow people to just live

889
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,800
authentically.
I, I, you, you've triggered a

890
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:10,480
thought, a memory that I, I
really want to share with your

891
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:12,240
matchmakers about my friend
Heather.

892
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:16,160
That's her real name, but I'm
sure there's more than one.

893
00:56:17,520 --> 00:56:20,160
And Heather is an accomplished
professional.

894
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:22,400
She got her start in Silicon
Valley.

895
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:25,680
Just amazingly intelligent,
insightful woman.

896
00:56:26,480 --> 00:56:29,400
And I've known her for more than
a decade.

897
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:35,000
Her challenge, and a lot of the
women and some of the single men

898
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:40,240
that I've met is you want to
have a serious relationship, but

899
00:56:40,240 --> 00:56:44,120
you want to have it with
somebody who's open minded and

900
00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:48,920
open to some sort of multi
partner situation.

901
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:51,640
Again, describe that dynamic as
it best suits you.

902
00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:55,000
And Heather explained to me in
great detail that she would go

903
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:59,480
on sites like OkCupid and Match
and eHarmony and she would meet

904
00:56:59,480 --> 00:57:01,760
a guy and they'd go on a few
dates.

905
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:06,080
And it was very difficult to get
to that point when you found

906
00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:08,840
somebody you liked to come
forward and say, by the way,

907
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:11,920
this is my kink or this is how I
like sex.

908
00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:14,120
So you don't want to wreck the
relationship with the guy that's

909
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:18,120
otherwise been great.
And then they pivot and go to

910
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:23,640
the adult sites and they get to
be, you know, forthcoming with

911
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:28,080
what their kink is.
But then they're treated like a

912
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:31,600
piece of meat with no brain and
no future.

913
00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:36,480
And so again, for matchmakers,
if they're willing to open that

914
00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:42,040
dialogue and saying, you know,
honestly, I don't even think

915
00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:43,560
honestly, I don't even think
it's about lifestyle.

916
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:47,040
I think it's do you think you
are interested?

917
00:57:47,040 --> 00:57:49,600
Do you enjoy things that you
think are non traditional?

918
00:57:51,080 --> 00:57:53,320
Absolutely.
And if the matchmaker can't

919
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:56,640
handle working with that client
because they don't have the

920
00:57:56,640 --> 00:58:00,640
resources in terms of a
database, there is there are

921
00:58:00,640 --> 00:58:02,880
management who specialize in
that area.

922
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:06,400
Like my student and I say
student, she's an established

923
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:08,320
matchmaker.
She's just in a part of our

924
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:10,720
mastermind.
Yeah.

925
00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:13,360
Then you refer them out to the
appropriate matchmaker that can

926
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:16,960
actually help the individual.
The the the goal of matchmaking

927
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:20,680
is to make meaningful
connections, whatever they may

928
00:58:20,680 --> 00:58:22,600
be.
It's not about the sex, it's

929
00:58:22,600 --> 00:58:26,120
about meaningful connections.
But sex is part of the

930
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:28,160
communication process between
people.

931
00:58:28,480 --> 00:58:31,080
And so we do have those
conversation and it's perfectly

932
00:58:31,080 --> 00:58:35,880
OK.
And yeah, so I'm really thrilled

933
00:58:35,880 --> 00:58:39,200
that you, you know, we had this
opportunity to have this

934
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:42,800
conversation and I hope people
got a lot out of it.

935
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:45,240
If anyone has questions, they
know they could always post

936
00:58:45,240 --> 00:58:48,960
questions in the social media
live streams that we put out

937
00:58:48,960 --> 00:58:51,640
there.
And of course, we will be

938
00:58:51,720 --> 00:58:55,160
sharing all of your details in
the show notes so that people

939
00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:57,600
can get in touch with you if
anyone's interested.

940
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:01,760
And until next time, keep making
meaningful connections, because

941
00:59:02,120 --> 00:59:04,360
that's where the real magic
begins.

942
00:59:08,840 --> 00:59:11,640
Thank you for tuning in to the
Matchmaker Mentor Podcast.

943
00:59:12,320 --> 00:59:15,280
If you enjoyed this episode,
don't forget to subscribe, leave

944
00:59:15,280 --> 00:59:17,840
a review, and share it with
fellow matchmakers and friends.

945
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:22,040
For more resources, training,
and inspiration, visit

946
00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:25,520
lovepromastermind.com and follow
us on social media.

947
00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:30,120
Remember, matchmaking isn't just
a career, it's a calling.

948
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:33,680
Let's keep building connections,
changing lives, and growing

949
00:59:33,680 --> 00:59:36,040
together.
Until next time, stay in.