What NOT to Say At A Funeral - with Barbara Bowman

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Hello and welcome to Thrive After 45, the podcast where we redefine what's possible in midlife.

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I'm Denise.

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Drink your midlife renewal coach here to help you embrace your power, purpose, and potential.

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This is your space to let go of guilt, navigate transitions, rediscover joy and thrive for you by you.

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Because of you, we are.

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Honored.

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Honored and it is a true privilege to introduce and welcome Barbara Bowman to thrive after 5 45 today.

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Barbara is a deeply compassionate author and speaker whose work on modern grief.

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Has been shaped by a lifetime of profound personal loss and a calling to help others feel seen, understood, and less alone in the midst of it with grace and honesty, she offers guidance through the quiet discomfort so many of us feel around death and grief, helping people find the right words, meaningful ways to show up.

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And space to simply be present when someone is hurting.

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Her insight is tender, timely, and filled with hard earned wisdom.

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And we're truly, truly grateful to have you, Barbara, here with us on Thrive after 45.

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So great to have you here today.

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Oh, well, no, my pleasure is mine.

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Thank you so much.

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That was that.

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That was a beautiful.

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How grateful I'm for those words.

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That was very nice of you to say.

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You're more than all and I won't deny any of it, but nope.

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And, and nor should you, my dear, nor should you.

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I love your energy.

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I have to say that right from the, uh, from the get go.

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As soon as I hear about grief and death and passing, a lot of us go into the sadness of all of that, and we're.

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Going to explore very challenging conversations that can happen around grief and death and dying, but we're not gonna do it in such a way that it pulls all of us down because you have got so much.

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Incredible, um, guidance and wisdom behind you on how to help people find words.

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When words seem to be lost during times of grief and sorrow.

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What happens or what happens as people.

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Try to digest and figure out what's the right thing to say.

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Have you noticed anything that's kind of common that happens with people?

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Oh, sure.

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Yeah.

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There's, there's a couple of very common situations that happen.

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If one is not familiar with grief, they haven't really lost any, anyone in their life yet.

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They'll often completely pull away, we'll, I'll just deal with them when, when they feel better, the awkwardness around what not to do.

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They become so self-focused.

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Ah, that they just separate, not realizing that that's probably the worst thing you can do.

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Mm-hmm.

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And then the second thing that is often really very common and often causes mistakes or in relationships that have to be mended, is the comparison.

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You know, I lost.

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My grandmother, so I know how you must feel that you lost your son or your spouse.

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No, you don't.

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Yeah, no, you don't.

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The comparison, grief makes people feel like you don't understand my grief for what I'm going through.

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Because even though I do believe that there, there's a hard line between people who have grieved and people who haven't grieved.

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Okay.

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With personal loss, I mean like not, you know, grieving a job or.

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Different, right.

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Kind of personal loss that is an experience that you now have in your life that you'll never have had before you, so you can't really explain it to someone.

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Right.

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But the secondary miscon misconception happens when the relationship of what's lost is so different to each person.

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Yes.

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So when, my example, if you had a grandmother that died and you're younger and she was always very elderly and older, and then she was ill and you expected it.

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That goes along the traditional lines of life and death and you're, you're, you've always waited for the step and you're sad because you miss, you're, you know, you're Meemaw, um, right.

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But that, that depth is nowhere in comparison to a daily relationship you have with someone who may have died spontaneously through, especially a younger person, through a drug overdose or a suicide car accident.

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These are so much more traumatic.

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And more deeply felt right.

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Um, especially to someone who's in that immediate family.

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And there's a, that the idea that it can be different and that's when people feel really like, you just don't get me.

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And now that friendship may be severed and I just don't want that to happen to anyone.

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Right, right.

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But so there's a lot of ways to get around that.

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Yeah, and I think that's one of the things in the book that we talk, that I talk about is to make, don't make that mistake.

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Don't compare.

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Just be there for them in their grief.

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And don't, even though you wanna feel like I, I understand you really don't.

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Mm-hmm.

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You can understand in another way, but not in a comparison.

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Really, really like what you're saying in terms of that comparison piece.

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How do we take it from it being about us?

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To move the needle to make it about being about them?

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Or how do we, yeah.

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How do we do that?

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Or is that important?

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I think it's incredibly important.

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'cause it's not about you at all.

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Mm-hmm.

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Well, the only way it really tends to be about, um, the support person is what kind of person do you wanna be?

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What kind of friend do you wanna be?

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What kind of, what kind of boss do you wanna be?

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What kind of neighbor do you wanna be?

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That is the only place it really has to do with you is the do unto others reflection.

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Love, love that.

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Besides that, it really has to do with honoring and respecting, gonna honor the per the person's life that passed.

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And that has nothing to do with, with, with your life or your discomfort or your confusion and being, um, I'm respectful of what the wishes and the family member, um, friend or colleague expects to do.

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By that maybe you have a colleague at work who's, someone has passed, but they're not, they're of a different religious sect and you don't understand what to do.

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Fair.

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You still have to, maybe they have, maybe they're lucky because they have a um, background, which tells them they're going to grieve for a certain amount of time, or they get certain amount of days, or they have to do certain protocols, which in America and many Western cultures, we've lost that, which is why we're so confused and need help.

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How do you respect those, the wishes of the mourner and be honorable of the griever?

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Both of those things need to take you out of your comfort zone.

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Mm-hmm.

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And you should be really proud to do that.

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Hmm.

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You should be like, I'm gonna, this is gonna be good.

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I'm gonna be the best person I can be.

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That I love, love that.

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The two ways that I think about it.

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Yeah.

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Really, really love that.

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Um, I.

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It, it, it's not something that people normally practice either, is it?

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Well, not here.

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They don't, there are no, there are some countries that are pretty lucky where they have, you know, their ethnic background and geographic background cause them to have similar, uh, rituals and ceremonies that the entire neighborhood, city, country.

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They all do.

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They res and they respect, so that expectation has been set out for them.

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Right?

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In today's world, that's those countries and those areas are pretty far and few in between.

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Now we have multicultural, we have after CO where people just stopped having anything, right?

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What do we do?

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We have, you know, millennials who yeah, do this.

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And will not go, go, oh, I need to get a card.

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You know, which they're, they often can be kind of emotionally detached.

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Right.

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So we've, we have so many different varieties of what people could do.

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Right.

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We don't really know what to do.

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Yes.

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And having those toolbox of saying, here's some options, make perfect, make you a better person and have better relationships.

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'cause it's gonna happen.

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Right.

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You can't get around these things.

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Right, exactly.

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Because if you do nothing.

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That's doing something.

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If you do something that's doing something correct, it is if you do nothing.

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Yeah.

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Almost everyone I've ever spoken to Yeah.

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Said they know who didn't show up.

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Mm-hmm.

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You think they won't miss me?

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I do.

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Yeah.

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Um, and that is probably, I think, one of the most selfish things you can do.

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I mean, if you're not gonna show up for something.

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Or if they do have a, um, a celebration of life, a memorial service, any kind of person ceremony, and you knew that person, you better have a pretty bad stomach flu with a doctor's note.

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Yeah.

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Because yeah, right.

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I know folks that have said, well, I just can't be around dead people, so I can't go at any of those things.

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I'm like, well, it really is about you.

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Yeah.

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And how and how do you know they're gonna have an open casket?

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How come you can't go over here?

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You don't have to do that.

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Right.

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So it, they use it as an excuse, just not to be supportive, I think.

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And I've seen so many people, I have to say in my, what keeps the bills on?

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I mean, how, I mean what pays the bills, keeps lights on.

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Yeah.

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Is.

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You know, I have a, I have a, um, a med spa I do every day.

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I take care of people's skin and I do all the aging things, mostly red dots, barnacles, veins, and that means we are sitting in a room mm-hmm.

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For probably 35 minutes to an hour.

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Just me and one other person.

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And I'll have these clients as we get older, these clients, they become long-term clients.

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And because my clients, well, many of them will know that I've had an exceptional amount of death in my family.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, when they have a passing, it gives them an opportunity.

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We call it the chair of truth.

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They'll come in and say, I'll say, you know how I knew your mom had, had, had passed, you know, a month or a couple months ago?

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How, how's everything?

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Oh my goodness.

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You wouldn't believe.

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I would say 85% of the time, the first thing they say is, oh, guess what happened?

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Oh no.

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You know what happened?

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You know what someone did, you know what my sister-in-law did?

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You know, someone showed up.

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Can you believe this guy?

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And it's always this complaint, oh, almost always of things that have gone wrong that they didn't expect.

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People would've acted or responded in a certain way.

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And it really does stick with people.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, so having so many of these conversations.

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Dozens and dozens over the years for sure.

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Uh, we just needed to have a toolbox mm-hmm.

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For people to pull out different i different opportunities and just ways to make it smoother and easier for them.

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Right.

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It's amazing how the memory really picks those things out, and you never wanna be that person.

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Hmm.

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That they're thinking about that they're gonna tell later you about, right?

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Oh yeah.

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Did Jimmy marry that girl that she wore that Trampy dress to Uhuh Aunt Sue's funeral And she Oh yeah.

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They got married three years ago.

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Oh, so he married the Trampy one.

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She's gonna be remembered.

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It's a moment.

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You don't wanna be, you don't wanna be the person that sucks the life or the energy.

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Ah.

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And makes the spotlight on you, right.

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Uh, so, so, so good.

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Okay, so now my mind is reeling.

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What do we do?

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How, how do we get this information?

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You mentioned about a toolbox.

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How do we find our toolbox?

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Well, the toolbox that I've written yes, is a little, a little guide called what not to do at funerals, you know, at.

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So it's a way to perfect, protect you from eternal embarrassment.

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And it's on Amazon, it's only about 60 pages, and it's written to be quick and punchy and memorable because if you can get it quickly and you can download it on, on a candle, then you can yeah, can guide it, go through it, send it to a, um, a family member or a loved one and say, here's some ideas.

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Please don't let your kids screw this up.

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Right.

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And come out shining greatly.

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But it's it's way they can get it quick and they'll remember it and this way they'll share it.

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Mm, yeah.

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And this way, and, and that was the most important thing, was to be able to have these quick, punchy tools mm-hmm.

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Where they can flip through and feel like they have it under control.

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Mm-hmm.

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Now I have some options Right now, I'm not gonna be too awkward and now if I see someone else doing something, yes.

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I can help cover for them.

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Right?

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It all becomes about relationships.

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'cause this is one where you can really build new, build longer lasting relationships because you showed up in a way that was honoring and respectful and you helped other people love that.

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Yeah.

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They, that's, that's very, that's the ultimate kind thing to do when someone is of course looking, people are going through things that are really difficult.

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Mm-hmm.

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So, so it's pretty easy, but relationships.

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So how can somebody even repair a relationship after making, let's say, a funeral faux pa or falling short of a griever's expectations?

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There's a couple of ways you can do this, and it's so.

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Really, it's very easy to do.

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Yay.

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We like ease of all.

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Just own it.

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Just own it.

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Just own it.

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You know?

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We all, we all screw up.

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Just own it.

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Let, and if they get upset, that's okay too.

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Yeah.

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Let's say, and here's a, I mean, there's a couple quick examples being like, yeah, funeral happens all the time.

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People get nervous.

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Um, I had someone say they were in the, they were in the pew and they're.

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Their aunt, the sister of their uncle that had died was giving a very heartfelt eulogy and they started talking a memory of their uncle doing something funny and they started laughing and they got the evil eye and they're mortified.

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You just have to walk, walk right up to her afterwards and say, mm-hmm.

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Always remember it's the relationship.

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Yes.

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And I can't remember her name and, and, uh, I'm so sorry for laughing.

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We were talking about Uncle Joe's.

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At Easter and every time he put that jelly bean up his nose, and I wonder if he still has a jelly bean up his nose right now and we love him so much and all.

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And so now you're thinking of it's about him.

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It's about the life and love that he gave.

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Right?

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You weren't joking about someone's hair.

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You go up and apologize.

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Tell him how much you love that, that person and that you love them.

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And hug and that's it.

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Yeah, it's over.

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Yeah.

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They know it wasn't about them.

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If you didn't show, and I had a friend who I thought would show and she didn't show.

00:15:35.826 --> 00:15:43.025
She dropped off some food the i the day after my son died and she didn't show up again and she was one of my best friends.

00:15:43.596 --> 00:15:45.456
And she has never forgotten his birthday.

00:15:46.235 --> 00:15:47.765
She's never forgotten a big Christmas.

00:15:48.485 --> 00:15:52.865
She's, every time we see her, she'll remind me of him years later.

00:15:52.956 --> 00:15:58.355
She's one of the few people that says, that, still thinks about him and thinks about his birthday.

00:15:58.355 --> 00:15:58.416
I.

00:15:58.760 --> 00:16:01.610
Thinks about, um, that I'm gonna remember his birthday.

00:16:02.811 --> 00:16:03.770
No one does that.

00:16:04.551 --> 00:16:07.520
So she wasn't there in the moment, but she's been there in the long haul.

00:16:07.880 --> 00:16:16.071
So if you thought, wow, later on I've read Barb's book and I've realized, wow, maybe this is why they never really talked to me so much anymore.

00:16:16.280 --> 00:16:20.870
You know, I thought I was just giving them space or I didn't know what to do, but I did drop off food.

00:16:21.201 --> 00:16:25.461
But now Barb doesn't, now she doesn't talk to me anymore, will show up.

00:16:25.850 --> 00:16:26.061
Mm-hmm.

00:16:26.301 --> 00:16:26.721
Memories.

00:16:26.725 --> 00:16:26.806
Mm-hmm.

00:16:27.350 --> 00:16:45.110
Keep that person alive and it's someone we love and anyone who ever brings up my brother, or there were dog stories we talk about our dogs had passed, someone goes, this is a way to reconnect and regrow a relationship that might feel like it was burnt to ashes.

00:16:45.260 --> 00:16:47.360
But there's always things that can grow from that.

00:16:47.541 --> 00:16:52.071
And memories and kindness continually is fantastic.

00:16:52.760 --> 00:16:55.640
You know, that's, and then the last one is probably.

00:16:57.110 --> 00:17:03.230
You know, if you have said something that you realize later, I shouldn't have said it.

00:17:03.471 --> 00:17:03.591
Mm-hmm.

00:17:04.431 --> 00:17:05.990
You don't always know what to say.

00:17:06.411 --> 00:17:06.711
Right.

00:17:07.070 --> 00:17:11.421
Thing I find one issue I have with Grievers mm-hmm.

00:17:11.661 --> 00:17:17.961
We get, we get, we don't have a lot of forgiveness sometimes for people who just don't know they're doing the best they can.

00:17:18.441 --> 00:17:20.270
They, they wanna say how you're doing.

00:17:20.270 --> 00:17:21.050
Mm-hmm.

00:17:22.246 --> 00:17:24.320
And the, and the griever all of a sudden.

00:17:25.476 --> 00:17:28.986
Of the level of grief they're going through gets really angry and says, what the hell?

00:17:28.986 --> 00:17:29.046
Yeah.

00:17:29.526 --> 00:17:29.945
What do you mean?

00:17:29.945 --> 00:17:30.726
How am I doing?

00:17:30.816 --> 00:17:31.685
I'm doing terrible.

00:17:31.715 --> 00:17:32.405
What do you think?

00:17:32.976 --> 00:17:33.576
Oh my gosh.

00:17:33.875 --> 00:17:34.506
What do you do?

00:17:35.135 --> 00:17:35.346
Right?

00:17:35.855 --> 00:17:39.846
You ask them, you say, I just, this is a great line.

00:17:39.846 --> 00:17:40.776
Just let them know.

00:17:40.836 --> 00:17:42.125
I've been thinking about you.

00:17:42.770 --> 00:17:46.490
And I know you're going through a hard time and I don't know how to check in with you.

00:17:46.490 --> 00:17:47.721
Could you tell me what to do?

00:17:47.721 --> 00:17:47.780
Hmm.

00:17:48.861 --> 00:17:54.770
If I've been thinking about you and I'm worried about you, I'm concerned about, I know it's difficult.

00:17:54.800 --> 00:17:56.961
I just don't, what's the best way I can check in?

00:17:57.201 --> 00:17:59.060
It's all about your heart and your relationship.

00:17:59.060 --> 00:18:00.800
Your words weren't the words they needed.

00:18:00.861 --> 00:18:02.300
The words frustrated them.

00:18:02.361 --> 00:18:05.000
You came at the wrong time, and they slammed the door in your face.

00:18:05.000 --> 00:18:06.171
'cause they didn't know want.

00:18:06.230 --> 00:18:08.151
They didn't want you to see their ugly cry.

00:18:08.300 --> 00:18:08.631
Right.

00:18:08.631 --> 00:18:10.250
Or give them, yeah, just go.

00:18:10.986 --> 00:18:11.976
Let me try again.

00:18:12.185 --> 00:18:12.306
Mm-hmm.

00:18:12.875 --> 00:18:19.506
Put your big boy pants on, put your boots on and go, I'm gonna pursue this again with an apology because I care about them.

00:18:19.806 --> 00:18:20.046
Right.

00:18:20.046 --> 00:18:21.425
Let them know I'm caring.

00:18:21.486 --> 00:18:22.385
Tell me what to do.

00:18:22.776 --> 00:18:22.895
Mm-hmm.

00:18:24.395 --> 00:18:28.236
I may have not said the right words, but it was, but I just am worried about you.

00:18:28.536 --> 00:18:28.986
That's it.

00:18:29.556 --> 00:18:29.705
Yeah.

00:18:29.705 --> 00:18:34.445
I may have showed up with the wrong time, but I'm really worried I'm gonna come back and just mow your lawn when you're not there.

00:18:35.826 --> 00:18:36.125
Yeah.

00:18:36.125 --> 00:18:36.185
Yeah.

00:18:36.935 --> 00:18:37.865
It's real quick.

00:18:37.865 --> 00:18:38.645
It's a two step.

00:18:39.020 --> 00:18:52.851
Yeah, and I guarantee you, I can pretty much guarantee you I, I know I say pretty much, but I feel like almost could say guarantee if you double show up for someone, yeah, you'll be the star.

00:18:53.286 --> 00:18:57.215
You have now pushed everything aside and said, I'm here for you.

00:18:57.276 --> 00:18:59.645
If you're in the ugly, I'm here for you.

00:18:59.645 --> 00:19:07.115
If it's not appropriate, I will still press in because you matter more to me and the relationship matters more to me then, you know, screw ups.

00:19:07.566 --> 00:19:07.685
Yeah.

00:19:07.685 --> 00:19:09.215
And aren't you the bigger person?

00:19:09.221 --> 00:19:09.270
Mm-hmm.

00:19:09.635 --> 00:19:11.046
Aren't you a cool person?

00:19:11.496 --> 00:19:11.645
Yeah.

00:19:11.645 --> 00:19:13.536
I couldn't think of anything less selfish.

00:19:13.865 --> 00:19:14.076
Yeah.

00:19:14.256 --> 00:19:16.685
Than putting your pride aside and trying again.

00:19:17.526 --> 00:19:17.615
Yeah.

00:19:17.615 --> 00:19:19.476
I want all those people in my life.

00:19:21.681 --> 00:19:23.121
For sure, a hundred percent.

00:19:23.990 --> 00:19:30.651
The people who can take themselves out of the equation and do what you've been talking about.

00:19:31.161 --> 00:19:32.270
Where's your kindness?

00:19:32.270 --> 00:19:33.471
Where's your compassion?

00:19:33.500 --> 00:19:39.651
Where is your ability to put you aside and be there for them?

00:19:39.651 --> 00:19:43.340
What is it they need and where can you meet them at that right?

00:19:43.925 --> 00:19:44.736
Absolutely.

00:19:44.736 --> 00:19:46.056
And they may not know.

00:19:46.355 --> 00:19:47.526
Like, Hmm.

00:19:47.885 --> 00:19:47.945
Yeah.

00:19:47.945 --> 00:19:52.536
And so expecting people to know, and this is a great little thing about the book, let's say you screwed up.

00:19:52.566 --> 00:19:54.066
Here's some ideas you can get to fix it.

00:19:54.066 --> 00:19:58.236
And you'd be like, oh man, maybe that wasn't as big a lifetime screw up as I thought.

00:19:59.135 --> 00:19:59.286
Nice.

00:19:59.286 --> 00:20:00.066
That's a good thing.

00:20:00.486 --> 00:20:00.665
Yeah.

00:20:00.695 --> 00:20:03.096
And because people don't know.

00:20:03.455 --> 00:20:03.635
Yeah.

00:20:03.691 --> 00:20:11.885
I mean, I can tell you from, from the experience and from the, the many groups that I've been a part of, of Grievers is that, um.

00:20:12.905 --> 00:20:15.486
We've had grief that we mo move through fairly quickly.

00:20:15.695 --> 00:20:16.145
Yep.

00:20:16.655 --> 00:20:23.046
Um, though we never really get rid of it, we just, it doesn't bring us down as much anymore.

00:20:23.046 --> 00:20:23.135
Right.

00:20:23.465 --> 00:20:28.655
But as long as you love someone, as long as you miss someone, you're gonna grieve a little all the time.

00:20:28.895 --> 00:20:28.986
Mm-hmm.

00:20:28.986 --> 00:20:30.155
You just get comfortable with it.

00:20:30.161 --> 00:20:30.330
Mm-hmm.

00:20:30.411 --> 00:20:30.570
Mm-hmm.

00:20:30.695 --> 00:20:31.536
Just part of it.

00:20:32.105 --> 00:20:32.286
Right.

00:20:32.316 --> 00:20:33.365
Uh, just part of life.

00:20:34.236 --> 00:20:38.586
Um, not knowing it can be really scary.

00:20:38.976 --> 00:20:39.546
Right.

00:20:39.965 --> 00:20:40.145
Yeah.

00:20:40.145 --> 00:20:43.671
It could be, it can be really scary and you might take that out Yeah.

00:20:44.796 --> 00:20:47.405
On, on the people around you.

00:20:47.405 --> 00:20:47.855
Mm-hmm.

00:20:48.096 --> 00:20:49.625
And to just give yourself a break.

00:20:49.986 --> 00:20:50.256
Right.

00:20:50.615 --> 00:21:01.175
You know, you've never been this person before and you've never been experienced these things before, and it's, and it's normal to feel awkward for both, both parties.

00:21:01.201 --> 00:21:02.375
Right, right.

00:21:02.435 --> 00:21:02.645
Yeah.

00:21:02.645 --> 00:21:05.556
And it's okay to feel a little, a little lost.

00:21:06.230 --> 00:21:07.371
It's totally okay.

00:21:07.641 --> 00:21:12.471
And if you have some tools to say, Hey, I'm, other people are obviously lost too.

00:21:12.770 --> 00:21:13.221
Yeah.

00:21:13.760 --> 00:21:16.941
And taking that expectation of off yourself, right.

00:21:16.971 --> 00:21:20.421
Um, then you all end up much better people.

00:21:20.810 --> 00:21:21.050
Right.

00:21:21.260 --> 00:21:23.000
And then the next time around it's easier.

00:21:23.030 --> 00:21:30.320
'cause I hate to say it, you know, as we get older, these are gonna come more often and then you become a pro pretty quick.

00:21:30.651 --> 00:21:32.240
Yeah, exactly.

00:21:33.080 --> 00:21:35.601
You mentioned about the book being on Amazon.

00:21:35.601 --> 00:21:47.300
I know for sure we've gonna put all that in the show notes, but if you can tell us the exact title again of the toolbox that we need to purchase.

00:21:47.361 --> 00:21:59.060
We were talking earlier before we started and said, you know how when we were having children and there was the book, what to Expect When You're Expecting, and everybody had that.

00:21:59.060 --> 00:21:59.300
I.

00:21:59.675 --> 00:22:03.066
I probably, if I look up on my bookshelf, I probably still have it up here.

00:22:04.145 --> 00:22:11.826
We need to have the toolbox that you have created exactly the same way it needs to be in every household because it should.

00:22:11.855 --> 00:22:16.205
This is part of life is departure and death.

00:22:17.046 --> 00:22:25.115
It is and, and learning how to be there for others is amazing because you set an expectation and so it's what not to do at funerals.

00:22:26.135 --> 00:22:27.546
There you go, what not to do at funeral.

00:22:28.445 --> 00:22:31.175
I mean, it's great to have, it's just great to have it around for generations.

00:22:31.181 --> 00:22:31.461
Yeah.

00:22:31.746 --> 00:22:31.895
Yeah.

00:22:31.895 --> 00:22:32.586
It's amazing.

00:22:32.705 --> 00:22:37.355
It, there are a lot of punchy anecdotes in it really for a younger generation.

00:22:37.655 --> 00:22:38.016
Yeah.

00:22:38.016 --> 00:22:43.596
Um, because honestly, even, even though everybody can kind of use this.

00:22:44.211 --> 00:22:46.340
The under 35 group really needs it.

00:22:46.820 --> 00:22:46.971
Yeah.

00:22:46.971 --> 00:22:49.040
I think they're, they're even more lost.

00:22:49.221 --> 00:22:54.260
So it's just great to have around, and I'm starting to work with some funeral homes to help put, put it out there.

00:22:54.320 --> 00:22:55.490
Nice.

00:22:55.611 --> 00:23:00.530
But it just makes life so much easier when you go, okay, I know what to do.

00:23:00.770 --> 00:23:01.010
Yeah.

00:23:01.010 --> 00:23:04.161
You know, I know how to be, not to be, not to be afraid.

00:23:04.671 --> 00:23:05.090
Right.

00:23:05.391 --> 00:23:05.691
Yeah.

00:23:05.695 --> 00:23:10.790
Uh, I mean, we, we, as we get older, we get less, hopefully we get less afraid of life.

00:23:11.361 --> 00:23:11.721
Mm-hmm.

00:23:11.961 --> 00:23:12.381
Mm-hmm.

00:23:12.382 --> 00:23:12.383
Yeah.

00:23:12.965 --> 00:23:16.806
But that doesn't always mean that we become better people.

00:23:17.105 --> 00:23:17.465
Right?

00:23:17.885 --> 00:23:18.215
Yeah.

00:23:18.425 --> 00:23:19.026
Very good.

00:23:19.566 --> 00:23:22.355
And so this is a way maybe to do both, right?

00:23:22.776 --> 00:23:38.766
Because it doesn't always mean that the per one person who shows up at the memorial service who's crying louder than anybody else because they're a drama queen, and they have to be the center of attention, Uhhuh, maybe you have someone in the, in your immediate family that walks over and goes.

00:23:40.760 --> 00:23:41.570
Let's go over here.

00:23:41.570 --> 00:23:42.141
Can I bring you?

00:23:42.141 --> 00:23:42.740
Yeah.

00:23:42.746 --> 00:23:45.381
Obviously you seems a little too upset to be here.

00:23:45.500 --> 00:23:45.681
Yeah.

00:23:45.681 --> 00:23:47.391
Why don't I take you into the bathroom?

00:23:47.631 --> 00:23:49.131
She'll be quite quiet like this.

00:23:49.340 --> 00:23:49.760
Yeah.

00:23:50.211 --> 00:23:50.480
Yeah.

00:23:51.050 --> 00:23:52.371
But you need a person like that.

00:23:52.371 --> 00:23:54.770
And then if you can laugh about it ahead of time.

00:23:55.070 --> 00:23:55.161
Mm-hmm.

00:23:55.401 --> 00:23:56.601
Know they're gonna show up.

00:23:56.871 --> 00:23:57.201
Right.

00:23:57.201 --> 00:23:58.310
Have a game plan.

00:23:58.641 --> 00:23:58.971
Yep.

00:23:59.391 --> 00:24:00.740
Everything goes smoother.

00:24:01.161 --> 00:24:01.820
Right.

00:24:02.435 --> 00:24:04.221
And I love what you're saying too, because.

00:24:05.151 --> 00:24:22.161
Whether you know they're gonna show up or not, there might be somebody else that comes in with the same profile, the same thing that you don't even know who they are, but you need to circumvent to help change the energy in that room so that it is a supportive environment.

00:24:22.161 --> 00:24:33.381
So you can take the information in this incredible, easy to read toolbox that you've created, and you've got it in your back pocket for.

00:24:33.871 --> 00:24:36.000
All kinds of scenarios.

00:24:36.060 --> 00:24:36.270
Right.

00:24:36.300 --> 00:24:38.101
Oh, that's so true.

00:24:38.161 --> 00:24:39.030
Absolutely.

00:24:40.290 --> 00:24:44.820
A lot of these, a lot of these will work in a, in many different situations.

00:24:44.911 --> 00:24:45.121
Right.

00:24:45.121 --> 00:24:51.030
You know, I think we are just a, we're just a people that have often forgot about the basics.

00:24:51.270 --> 00:24:51.421
Yeah.

00:24:52.260 --> 00:24:52.951
There it is.

00:24:53.461 --> 00:24:54.961
And we overcomplicate things.

00:24:54.961 --> 00:24:55.826
Then we end up lying.

00:24:56.615 --> 00:24:58.806
And you know, maybe a little fib or whatever.

00:24:59.046 --> 00:25:03.726
We're trying to make ourselves look better and really people like us when we don't look so good.

00:25:03.726 --> 00:25:03.786
Yeah.

00:25:04.086 --> 00:25:05.915
People love our houses when they're messy.

00:25:06.336 --> 00:25:06.576
Yeah.

00:25:06.576 --> 00:25:08.286
And they love us when our hair isn't right.

00:25:08.675 --> 00:25:10.955
And if we miss a button, they love us even more.

00:25:10.955 --> 00:25:13.355
And if you don't zip up your pants, your friends forever.

00:25:13.625 --> 00:25:13.925
Yeah.

00:25:15.395 --> 00:25:18.365
But people love it to know that you're normal.

00:25:18.486 --> 00:25:19.326
Yeah.

00:25:19.385 --> 00:25:23.766
And so when these are normal things, they're normal mistakes.

00:25:23.915 --> 00:25:24.306
Yeah.

00:25:25.086 --> 00:25:26.675
But they're all survivable.

00:25:27.066 --> 00:25:28.385
Right, exactly.

00:25:28.685 --> 00:25:31.385
We just can't take ourselves too seriously though.

00:25:31.385 --> 00:25:33.125
These are very serious situations.

00:25:33.125 --> 00:25:33.486
Of course, yeah.

00:25:33.486 --> 00:25:34.836
People will get very upset.

00:25:35.435 --> 00:25:39.546
It's also a book people should kind of read before a, a service.

00:25:39.605 --> 00:25:39.695
Yeah.

00:25:40.205 --> 00:25:40.776
Yep.

00:25:41.556 --> 00:25:42.246
Good point.

00:25:42.726 --> 00:25:53.135
Sometimes you have an extended family, uh, you know, cousins and and whatnot, and they may not be in the receiving line if they do a receiving line or they may not be a part of the eternal life, or Yep.

00:25:53.135 --> 00:25:54.455
Sometimes it's just the front row.

00:25:54.665 --> 00:25:58.685
It's nice to have someone who's a secondary, um, or tertiary family member.

00:25:58.746 --> 00:25:59.256
Yes.

00:25:59.556 --> 00:26:02.945
To be a watcher for things.

00:26:02.945 --> 00:26:04.260
Maybe someone coming in late.

00:26:04.750 --> 00:26:05.101
Right.

00:26:05.391 --> 00:26:13.671
You know, uh, someone who's got children maybe start crying or love the echo in the church if it's or, or, sure.

00:26:15.141 --> 00:26:16.191
Like not now.

00:26:16.340 --> 00:26:17.540
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:26:17.540 --> 00:26:20.270
Someone to help manage some of these things that can happen.

00:26:20.631 --> 00:26:20.810
Right.

00:26:20.810 --> 00:26:23.810
And just to help things move a little smoother.

00:26:23.871 --> 00:26:24.830
And I've done that.

00:26:24.921 --> 00:26:27.980
I've done that at, at, at a couple of, of mm-hmm.

00:26:28.221 --> 00:26:28.790
Services.

00:26:29.211 --> 00:26:29.361
Yeah.

00:26:29.901 --> 00:26:30.861
Someone come in and.

00:26:31.266 --> 00:26:33.246
You see that it's making someone more upset.

00:26:33.455 --> 00:26:33.935
Right.

00:26:34.385 --> 00:26:35.705
They don't know what to say or do.

00:26:35.705 --> 00:26:37.596
They don't know how to get away from this person.

00:26:38.435 --> 00:26:39.635
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:26:39.996 --> 00:26:44.346
And, and inevitably the person will try to pull up a chair next to them and wanna sit down.

00:26:44.556 --> 00:26:45.756
You're like, oh, you're just making it.

00:26:45.996 --> 00:26:47.405
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:26:47.796 --> 00:26:48.455
Read the room.

00:26:48.455 --> 00:26:49.086
Read the room.

00:26:49.086 --> 00:26:49.685
I've got it.

00:26:49.715 --> 00:26:50.046
Yep.

00:26:51.125 --> 00:26:52.655
I know there's people who just.

00:26:53.510 --> 00:26:55.221
But, and, and absolutely.

00:26:55.221 --> 00:26:56.810
I mean, that's what makes the world go round.

00:26:56.840 --> 00:27:05.510
However, the tips and strategies that you have give you an opportunity to see how you can be that support.

00:27:05.601 --> 00:27:12.020
How can you help make this, um, less stressful?

00:27:12.050 --> 00:27:19.280
How can you impact in a way that makes everything go more smoothly in whatever way that can be?

00:27:19.851 --> 00:27:21.351
How are gonna show up?

00:27:21.816 --> 00:27:22.506
Exactly.

00:27:22.506 --> 00:27:24.905
And people don't know how to show up even when they write a card.

00:27:24.996 --> 00:27:28.596
I find out the two biggest questions that I get Okay.

00:27:28.596 --> 00:27:30.905
Are, what can I say other than I'm sorry.

00:27:31.685 --> 00:27:33.036
Like, I just wanna say, I'm sorry.

00:27:33.036 --> 00:27:33.816
I wanna say I'm sorry.

00:27:33.875 --> 00:27:36.816
And people on the other side say, I heard that so many times.

00:27:36.816 --> 00:27:37.685
I don't wanna say I'm sorry.

00:27:38.256 --> 00:27:38.766
Mm-hmm.

00:27:38.767 --> 00:27:41.316
Um, and, and do I really have to go?

00:27:42.125 --> 00:27:44.826
How can I, how can I get out of going to an event?

00:27:44.855 --> 00:27:46.086
And that's, that's easy.

00:27:46.536 --> 00:27:47.645
You can't Yep.

00:27:48.276 --> 00:27:48.576
Yep.

00:27:48.756 --> 00:27:50.076
So you can't No.

00:27:50.195 --> 00:27:50.556
Go.

00:27:51.381 --> 00:27:51.560
Yep.

00:27:52.010 --> 00:27:52.340
Yep.

00:27:52.401 --> 00:27:53.000
There's your answer.

00:27:53.000 --> 00:27:54.681
Summit flu, hospital, car accidents.

00:27:54.681 --> 00:27:56.480
You gotta, you gotta be completely incomp.

00:27:56.540 --> 00:27:57.560
Incapacitated.

00:27:57.770 --> 00:28:01.161
Or you better just, you know, change your name.

00:28:01.671 --> 00:28:01.881
Yeah.

00:28:02.510 --> 00:28:02.780
Facebook page.

00:28:03.351 --> 00:28:05.090
Get a new, get a new zip code.

00:28:05.090 --> 00:28:06.111
Get a new postal code.

00:28:06.111 --> 00:28:06.381
Yep.

00:28:07.461 --> 00:28:16.101
But I, I think in, if I could take all the options that I have in the book of things to say, and there's even more, I'll probably add a few more on, I believe.

00:28:16.191 --> 00:28:19.070
When if, do you wanna find something other than, I'm sorry.

00:28:19.461 --> 00:28:27.500
Say anything about the person, if it was a person at work or really Miss Joe at work, he was always a good, it was always a good joke.

00:28:27.800 --> 00:28:29.181
You know, I always had a great joke for the day.

00:28:29.181 --> 00:28:29.240
Yeah.

00:28:29.480 --> 00:28:30.770
Something personal.

00:28:30.861 --> 00:28:32.030
That's all it matters.

00:28:32.391 --> 00:28:32.510
Yeah.

00:28:32.510 --> 00:28:35.451
You know, I'm hurting every time I think about it.

00:28:35.540 --> 00:28:37.250
That's not, it's not a comparison.

00:28:37.310 --> 00:28:37.790
Mm-hmm.

00:28:38.030 --> 00:28:38.121
Mm-hmm.

00:28:39.141 --> 00:28:42.830
The first thing that comes to mind is really the best thing.

00:28:43.221 --> 00:28:43.520
Mm-hmm.

00:28:43.760 --> 00:28:47.391
As long as it's not like, I wonder how they died or, you know, something appropriate.

00:28:48.290 --> 00:28:54.740
The first thing, people always forget the first thing because it just doesn't seem, it seems too real, right?

00:28:54.921 --> 00:28:57.980
It seems personal because it makes them sad.

00:28:58.925 --> 00:29:05.855
I was gonna say it, it probably makes them connected to their sadness, which is what we talked about in the beginning.

00:29:05.855 --> 00:29:08.046
It's not about you, it's about the other person.

00:29:08.046 --> 00:29:17.915
But you're reframing that all together to help it make a connection so they can hear the impact that person has had in your life.

00:29:18.425 --> 00:29:18.726
Right?

00:29:18.726 --> 00:29:18.996
Yes.

00:29:18.996 --> 00:29:22.385
If you say, I'm, you know, I'm hurting every time I think of you guys.

00:29:22.746 --> 00:29:22.836
Mm-hmm.

00:29:23.076 --> 00:29:25.086
And now you're sharing in their grief and they know you.

00:29:25.685 --> 00:29:25.746
Yeah.

00:29:25.746 --> 00:29:26.121
That, that.

00:29:27.336 --> 00:29:28.236
You care for them.

00:29:28.415 --> 00:29:28.506
Yeah.

00:29:28.506 --> 00:29:30.935
That's a supportive, perfect way of saying it.

00:29:31.300 --> 00:29:31.740
I love it.

00:29:31.740 --> 00:29:36.306
So anything like that, you've, I can't stop thinking about about you right now.

00:29:36.635 --> 00:29:41.016
I, I'm so sad and I'll continue to think about you forever.

00:29:41.080 --> 00:29:41.371
Yeah.

00:29:41.401 --> 00:29:41.691
Boom.

00:29:42.395 --> 00:29:42.786
Yeah.

00:29:43.266 --> 00:29:45.215
The first thing in your mind is always the best.

00:29:45.215 --> 00:29:49.715
And it's surprises to me how many people don't think that's what they should write.

00:29:49.961 --> 00:29:50.250
Yeah.

00:29:52.236 --> 00:29:54.276
So, great.

00:29:54.336 --> 00:29:54.996
Great.

00:29:55.955 --> 00:29:56.405
Information.

00:29:56.405 --> 00:29:57.455
It's about the relationship.

00:29:57.905 --> 00:29:58.326
Yeah.

00:29:58.326 --> 00:29:59.526
Yeah, yeah.

00:30:00.125 --> 00:30:00.695
I love it.

00:30:00.965 --> 00:30:01.506
I love it.

00:30:02.826 --> 00:30:11.915
Thank you so much, Barbara, for this conversation was we don't mess around here.

00:30:11.921 --> 00:30:12.750
There's so much more.

00:30:13.371 --> 00:30:20.465
So there's so many goofy things that happen and so it's, you know, it's, it's a fun quick little read.

00:30:20.526 --> 00:30:24.006
It's, you know, the what not to do at funerals is, it's really, I think it's.

00:30:24.530 --> 00:30:27.980
It's getting more and more popular and the conversations are fun.

00:30:28.431 --> 00:30:31.040
Yeah, and, and honestly, I.

00:30:31.520 --> 00:30:51.921
The fact that you have gone through so much loss in your life and you are able to help others show up for other people who are going through challenging times with grief and death is so, so valuable, and I am so grateful.

00:30:51.921 --> 00:30:55.941
Our paths have crossed to have this snippet conversation.

00:30:56.181 --> 00:30:57.171
We will.

00:30:57.181 --> 00:30:58.621
Come back together again.

00:30:58.651 --> 00:30:59.340
I know it.

00:30:59.641 --> 00:31:09.840
I know there's other things coming in the near future that you are busy creating and crafting right now, because I love your ideas of make it simple.

00:31:09.840 --> 00:31:13.800
Don't make this such a big deal, but do it properly.

00:31:13.800 --> 00:31:13.861
Yeah.

00:31:13.980 --> 00:31:14.401
Right.

00:31:14.671 --> 00:31:26.580
I'm, I have to tell you, I can't, when someone says, you look at, um, you know, here's three things you should say every day to make your life easier, and then you look down at the corner of the little video and it says 45 minutes click.

00:31:27.111 --> 00:31:29.540
If, why can't you tell me that in five minutes?

00:31:29.540 --> 00:31:30.441
It's only three words.

00:31:30.740 --> 00:31:32.451
Just give me the information.

00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:32.540
Yeah.

00:31:32.540 --> 00:31:33.770
And let me start in on it.

00:31:33.770 --> 00:31:33.830
Yeah.

00:31:34.236 --> 00:31:38.300
I, I am, I hate to say it, and maybe your colleagues will, will realize this.

00:31:38.540 --> 00:31:43.371
I'm an American, we don't read instructions until we can't find all the schools.

00:31:44.421 --> 00:31:46.790
I just, I just know how to do it.

00:31:46.790 --> 00:31:52.101
Just lemme jump in and start, gimme the, you know, the tools that I need with Yeah.

00:31:53.090 --> 00:31:56.060
Without the drama and I can use them to the best of my ability.

00:31:56.060 --> 00:32:00.020
And it's quick and simple and then life goes on hopefully better.

00:32:00.411 --> 00:32:01.161
Exactly.

00:32:01.161 --> 00:32:04.191
And if you need more, you can find out how to reach you.

00:32:04.340 --> 00:32:04.671
Right?

00:32:04.701 --> 00:32:12.830
Like if they need more information or absolutely need to ask you specific questions, you can go to bohart.com.

00:32:13.040 --> 00:32:13.371
Yeah.

00:32:14.421 --> 00:32:14.931
Um.

00:32:15.621 --> 00:32:25.671
The information's also, you know, what not to do at Funerals Loss Amazon, but also@bohart.com where I'll, um, start have some other books and presentation information and things like that.

00:32:25.671 --> 00:32:25.820
Nice.

00:32:25.826 --> 00:32:31.820
They can find, if they have any questions, they can always email me or contact me through there, and I'd be thrilled to get back to them.

00:32:32.361 --> 00:32:32.631
Perfect.

00:32:32.631 --> 00:32:33.800
Good or bad, I can't wait.

00:32:34.221 --> 00:32:35.060
Exactly.

00:32:35.121 --> 00:32:35.931
Exactly.

00:32:36.201 --> 00:32:38.750
Thank you so much for your time today, Barbara.

00:32:38.750 --> 00:32:42.830
It's always a pleasure to see your smiling face on the other side of our screen.

00:32:44.151 --> 00:32:44.152
Okay.

00:32:46.760 --> 00:32:51.651
Make sure that you follow Thrive after 45 so you don't miss.

00:32:51.655 --> 00:33:13.885
Any of these nuggets of gold that are shared, and we have such a variety of guests, it has been an honor and a privilege to share space today with Barbara and her wisdom behind being real around death and grief, and supporting people to move in the way that is best for them.

00:33:14.096 --> 00:33:15.296
It's not about you.

00:33:15.476 --> 00:33:18.536
How could you show up and support others?

00:33:18.576 --> 00:33:19.925
In their grief.

00:33:20.346 --> 00:33:21.365
Take care of yourselves.

00:33:21.365 --> 00:33:27.965
Make sure you do something for you by you because of you today and every day, and we will see you on the next show.

00:33:28.326 --> 00:33:29.316
Goodbye everyone.