Who Knows You're Phenomenal? with Nicole Johnston

Hello, and welcome to Thrive After 45. I'm Drinkwalter, heart whisperer, midlife mirror, and And every week, I am honored to share energy and space with inspiring guests whose stories reflect so many possibilities of thriving beyond 45. Together, we'll uncover the whispers of the heart, the power of midlife transformation, and the wisdom that fuels expansion. Because when one woman turns her light on, the rest of the room catches fire Nicole Johnson spent 30 years climbing the corporate ladder, leading sales and marketing for consumer product companies, and along the way she discovered something more valuable than any title. She realized that real success isn't just about reaching the top, it's about who you bring with you. an executive and leadership coach, Nicole now helps women figure out why they feel stuck, and gives them the tools to move forward with clarity and confidence. Her philosophy comes from decades of trying to leave every person who worked alongside her in a better place than she found them, and she has touched hundreds of lives doing exactly this. Today, Nicole is bringing the same wisdom to us, and we are getting into one of the biggest questions facing women right now: What is really standing in the way of their advancements? Nicole, welcome to our show today. I can't wait for our conversation. Oh, thank you so much. I'm very excited to be here. So tell us a little bit about how you got to what it is you are doing today so our audience has a clearer picture. I just did a very quick snapshot, but let's get a little deeper into Nicole. So I worked 30 years in corporate, the corporate world, and for massive companies, and I was in consumer products, so we're talking, you know, Tide, Downy, Huggies- Yep you know, these kinds of products. You, you all have them in your homes. And as I was working in these companies and getting larger roles, bigger scope, bigger responsibility, I kept seeing amazing women get looked over- Mm pushed aside, pigeonholed into, "Oh, but you're so good at..." You know, those kinds of things. And in addition to that, I started having salary control, I recognized how many of the women were underpaid, below the salary bands they should have been in, you know, repeat, on and on and on. And so as I was doing that, I became very aware of women, minorities, you know, people, LGBTQ, anything, that they were always a little bit off center as far as what they should be receiving for compensation, what the roles that be available to them, opportunities that they should be up for. And it became a focus of mine in corporate world. And, I was head of sales marketing, and I realized how much I loathed sales. And when you're the head of sales, that's not good It's not quite a match. And if I had to sit in one more meeting where I said, "You said you were going to take 1,000 pallets. You took 900. Why?" I was not gonna be in a good place anymore. But the meetings where I got to have the discussions of, "What do you wanna be when you grow up? What really excites you? What is the work you wanna do?" You know, those were the meetings I loved. The sales meetings, not so much. And so I s- had to figure out how I could step away from the sales aspect and instead talk about the people aspect, and that's why I left to become an executive and leadership coach, is because I have seen all the things that happen with women, with people of color, with men, you know, all of that, and I wanna help them break through. Mm-hmm. And so that's why I left corporate to start my business. So, so many things you've just unpacked. Yeah. This is why you're on this show, because we are talking about thriving after 45, and of course, we are, narrowing in and talking to women, although we know we have a variety of listeners, which we are so grateful for. Yeah. With that being said, why is that a reality? What is going on behind the scenes about what you just shared, and how much of that do we, and I'm doing quotations for those who are listening and not seeing the visual, what is actually happening with regards to that? Who owns this? Yeah. Let's, let's start with Gen X, because over 45 is Gen X and the, and Xennials, the ones who are the bridge between millennials and the Gen X. As a generation, you know, we were the generation. We were the ones that they literally had advertisements that say, "It's 10:00. Do you know where your kids are?" Because they, we were, we were running the neighborhoods. We were just feral, and we were taught, we were raised to get things done, to show up, get it done, and move on. Yeah. And with that, it was expected that you would get your work done in a quality way, that you would not seek adulation, and you would move on to the next thing. The giant problem with that- Mm-hmm is that you become very effective at doing things, but people don't really know what you do, they don't know what you're good at, and they certainly don't know what your goals and aspirations are. Right. we just put our heads down and get things done. Mm-hmm. It's very difficult to say, "Oh, she wants to be a CFO. Oh, she wants to be the next Instead it's like, "Oh my gosh, she is so great at that. We're just gonna leave her there and let her run." And because we were socialized literally from the time that we were running the neighborhoods to be quiet about things- Mm-hmm and just get it done. Mm-hmm. That approach has carried into corporate. And because of that, we are usually very poor at saying, "I did this. I did this well. I created an entire new process that saved us money. I was able to disrupt X, Y, Z, and that's the benefit." Instead we just assume that people will know. Right. Right. And that assumption is what's holding us back. Wow. I love what you're saying, because what I'm hearing you say is with knowing it that way, we have the power to change it, because it's being- 100%. Okay, let's go. 100%. Let's go. How do we change it? Let's start with, I'm gonna make all the Gen Xers very uncomfortable right now. I want you to say out loud- Mm something you are good at. Take a moment. I want you to say something you are good at, and recognize the truth behind it. Mm. And I want you to sit in that discomfort and recognize that discomfort is fake. It is not real. It is something that you are assuming versus recognizing the reality is you are kicking ass on something, and you deserve the credit for it So now I want you to take that same thinking to work. Mm-hmm. What are you exemplary at at work? What are you doing that is phenomenal? Now, here's the uncomfortable part. Who knows? Ah, that's- Who knows what you're doing that you're phenomenal at? So I know I have a lot of listeners right now that are squirming and saying- "Ah, like this, this is not right." But instead, I want you to think about who you can talk to what you're phenomenal at. now, I know again, many people are very uncomfortable on this. Start with the ones that are safe, meaning you have data. Mm. And so let's say there is a task at work that you finish at 110% every time, and most everyone else is at 90. Clear data says you are exemplary at that task. Mm-hmm. Start with those. Those are the easy ones. Mm. And the way you start with it is in your next one-on-one with your boss, you say, "Hey, Boss. Do you see that for the sixth month in a row I have over-delivered and crushed this? That's amazing. I would love to do more in this space, so if there's a project or a task or an opportunity, I would love to talk about it." Mm-hmm. Then you walk out of the room going, "Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God." But it's- That's important. That's important. Yes. That piece- Yes is important to actually land on here and put a, put a pin in that, because what you're doing is a hard step, but in reality, when you, like you say, you leave, you're like, "Ah, I just did that," because it's not nor, again, quote, unquote, "normal"- Right to do that, right? Yeah. Right. Yeah. So step one, recognize what you're good at. Two, start having the conversations. Now, something that I recommend for everybody, regardless of age- Yeah regardless of, is to have an attagirl folder, and what I mean by that is- Mm somebody says, "Hey, thank you so much for X, Y, Z," put it in the folder. You get a Slack message that said, "Oh, my gosh, you saved my bacon because of blah, blah, blah," put it in the folder. You led a project and you recapped it at the end, put it in the folder. Now, this folder will serve you for a couple of things. One, if you, like 99.9% of the population, hate writing your annual review 'cause you're like- "What did I do this year?" Your attagirl folder will tell you, a- and you'll be like, "Oh, my gosh, that's right, I did all this stuff." So it makes that very easy. Mm-hmm. Secondly, when you're having those very squidgy, uncomfortable conversations with your boss- Yeah you have data and information to share. Right. And third, when you're having those days of self-doubt, of, "Oh, my God, I can't possibly," look at your attagirl folder and be like, "Hey, wait a minute, I'm kinda good at this. Look at it, I have all this data here that says this." Yeah. It helps you build that that you may not naturally have. You actually have written documentation of it that can help bolster you. I love that. Can you take what you're sharing, we're talking about, you know, leadership becoming, you know, who... Fully enveloping who you truly are at the core, and recognize that the work that you do is phenomenal, and knowing where those pieces are. How can... Is there a place to move this into your everyday life as well? Instead of we're talking the business, now how can we move it over so that it actually impacts real life stuff too? Yeah. Let's talk about everything that you do. I mean, if you think about all that you accomplish in a day- Mm. Mm you're probably gonna like be a little bit exhausted and twitchy thinking about it. Because if you think about... So let's talk mental load for a second. Sure. In an average full-time job, you work roughly 2,000 hours a year, and the mental load, just to make sure everybody understands, is the work that has to happen that makes work and life flow. So it's the planning of the meetings, taking the notes, knowing who's allergic to what, you know, whatever. It's necessary work, but it's work that also disproportionately falls on women. Mm-hmm. So I'm getting to the personal stuff here, I promise. No problem. Yeah. At work alone- Yeah women do 200 hours of mental labor, and that is all non-promotable work. So five weeks of work, five weeks of work- Mm-hmm that is either added on top of what you're already doing or taking you away from five weeks of work that could get you promoted. Mm. At home- Mm-hmm there's another 520 hours of mental labor that women do. And so when you ask about how you can take this from work to home, is first of all start to recognize all the freaking work you do. Mm-hmm. Because you have been socialized to do it. It's happened so much of your life for long, you don't even recognize it. And when your partner, your spouse, someone says, "Well, just tell me what I can do," no, that's mental labor. You're an adult. You know what needs to be done. Don't put it on me. Mm. So how you bring that over to your personal life is- Mm-hmm take a week and write everything down. Yeah. Doesn't matter who it's for. "I confirmed Billy's dentist appointment. I washed Jamie's uniform." Write it all down. Okay. And look at it and go, "Ha, that's why I'm tired." And then have the conversation that says, "Partner, spouse, whomever- Mm-hmm I need you to take on some of this work." Mm. Because one, they have, same as your boss, has no idea what you're doing, your partner or spouse has no idea what you're doing. So you need to give them an entire grouping, meaning not, "Could you just get Billy to practice?" No. You now own Little League. That means registering for it, that means paying for it, that means understanding all the requirements. Does he have a glove? Does he need cleats? Da, da, da, da, da. Understanding the practices, managing the transport back and forth from the practices, knowing when the games are, taking care of the orange slices. Yeah. Yeah. You now own Little League. I'm going to take that part out of my brain, and you are now braining for Little League. That is yours. Mm-hmm. Having those kinds of conversations It will be mind-opening because, again, your spouse has no, or partner has no idea how much you just do because you make it look effortless. Right. But for you to get time for you- Mm-hmm you need someone else to brain on things at times versus you- Mm-hmm braining all the time. I love that. So take it to your home and just see all the stuff. Yeah. And then say, "I need help, and here's what I need you to do." Yeah. I like how you've, I'm gonna say, compartmentalized that, quote-unquote, let's just keep it external, the duties, right? Mm-hmm. So that you relieve all of the mental and physical and emotional stuff that's attached to that. Yep. How does this work when we as a person, as a woman, as a person over 45, has a challenge giving it to somebody else to do without the, I'm gonna call it micromanage, I don't know if that's the right term. But you're, you're smiling, so I guess you're understanding where I'm going with this one. Yeah. How do you release that in a way that doesn't cause even more stress for you, thinking about, "Well, they're not doing it the way I would do it," because I think that exists for s- some, if not many of us. Oh, absolutely. Okay. So you're, you're 100% hitting on how girls are socialized because- Right girls are socialized to get gold stars. We're socialized to be perfect. Boys are socialized to try. Mm. So if they try something and they fail, they're like, "Oh, that didn't work. Let's try again." If girls try and they fail, they step out or step back. Yeah. And so because of that, there becomes this immense society, societal pressure and internal pressure of- Right "I need to get the gold star in everything I do." And so what you just described, Denise, is- Yeah not getting the gold star. Yeah. And so we as women have to give ourselves permission to not be perfect. Mm-hmm. And so if your husband takes over Little League- Mm-hmm and Billy shows up with a dirty uniform- It is what it is. Life will go on, right? Life will go on. It is fine. And you have to recognize the reaction you're having- Yeah is not because Billy has a dirty uniform, 'cause Billy could not care less. It is your internal perception of, "Well, that's not what I would do. That's not how it would be. Oh my gosh." You have to let that go. Yeah. And recognize that is non-productive response, and it's only going to take more work to put back on you. Versus recognizing Little League is not my brain anymore, it's now my husband's brain, and if he shows up that way, that's on my husband. Mm-hmm. Now, can you say to your husband, "Dude, why didn't you wash the uniform?" Sure. But you're not going to own it and take it back. Love that. And perseverate and fixate on it. It's- Yes something now that you, you've, quote-unquote, "given," and now that leaves space for you again. Yeah. And this... Right? And this whole idea about Thrive After 45 is making sure you give back for you by you because of you, and that's why we're doing and having this conversation, right? Yes. Yeah. So- We are going to be taking steps, all the things you've shared so far. What are some ways we can begin this journey if we are the ones who are, we do it all, and we've heard all what you said. What is something we could start, or is there something we could start kind of right away to move our needle a little closer to being able to breathe again and step back as it, as it pertains to the right places, the right time, that kind of thing? Yeah. Start with things that give you a visceral reaction. Mm. And what I mean is if there is a certain person at work, a certain project at work, a certain committee at work, or it's something at your church, or it's something associated with Girl Scouts or Boy, whatever. If there's something that gives you the visceral reaction of, "Oh, my God," like, "Ugh," figure out how to start with that one. And the f- and know that- Yeah if you're having that kind of reaction to it, that is doubly draining to you. Because you have to psych yourself up to engage in it. When you engage, you hate it, so then afterwards, you're just like, "Oh." You know? Start with the visceral reaction. Figure out what those things are, and then figure out how to get someone else to do them. And so, like, I remember when I first started working, there was a guy who was like, "Oh, my gosh, your PowerPoints are so much better than mine. Would you mind doing it? 'Cause yours are so good." And so I did it for a little while, but then I'm like, "I'm not his damn secretary." Wait a minute. Like, no. Yeah. Yeah. And so the next time he asked me, and I said, "You're right. Mine are better than yours. Why don't you take a shot at this one, and then we can work together so I can show you how to improve it?" Love that. And he just looked at me, and he's like, "But that's not what I want." I said, "I understand that's not what you want, but I'm telling you, this is how I'll help you." And I never had to do another PowerPoint for him again. And but it was a simple matter of me putting up boundaries and sticking to those boundaries. So what is the thing that you have that visceral bad reaction to? Mm-hmm. And then figure out how you can put boundaries up. You may not be able to exit completely. You might be able to, but it might be something that you could still step back 10 paces and be like, "Nope, I can handle it at this level. I'm not gonna have that gut clench at this level, but I need to step back these ways to do that." Start with those. Love that. You just did a brilliant job of showing and sharing the language to be able to use for that, and I know a lot of women talk to me about tripping up, "I just can't find the words. I don't know what to say." And what I heard you say very, very clearly in your response to the question was that scenario. You heard what he said. You acknowledged what he said that, that added to your cup to start with. So that is a really powerful tool to pull and extract when you are starting to understand about boundaries and put those into place, is to make sure you understand what they're doing to get it to you instead of them doing it, and then I loved how you said that. Because there's so many expectations put on you based off of assumptions. Like, I have a friend of mine. Mm-hmm. Her older son is allergic to so many things. And so whenever it came time to do things for class, she would end up doing very specialized baking and treats and everything so her son could participate, because he just couldn't eat the majority of things 'cause he had just- Right so many anaphylactic allergies. Hmm. And so the teacher got used to that, and went, "Yeah, great." You know, and she would make them for other kids and whatever. It was all good. Mm-hmm. Well then, when her came through, her d- her daughter didn't have any allergies, and the teacher was like, "Well, where are the treats?" She's like, "Here." "But where are, where are the, the treats?" The treats. Yeah. "Why would I make those? My daughter doesn't need that." "Oh, but I was expecting that." And she's like, "I don't know why you would have expected that, 'cause my daughter doesn't need it, but I'm providing what I said I would." Right. And you could tell the teacher was like, "But I want the other ones." But my, but my friend's like, "No, I'm... Why would I create more work for myself- Mm when this is perfectly adequate and no kid's gonna complain? And if you, teacher, are sad about that, well, sorry, here's the recipes." But, you know, it was... She said it was a fascinating- Hmm eye-opening moment for her because she recognized how often in life people make assumptions of what you are going to do versus actually clarifying and being very precise on it. I love that. Yeah. It, and it's about communication, isn't it? Yeah. Right? Really. Yep. Yep. Solid communication, knowing what it is you need, what it is you're going to say, and how you're going to say it. And the more you practice this, I'm absolutely, 100% sure it just starts rolling off the tongue without issue, right? Yes. Yeah. And m- can I invite you to- Yes my favorite phrase ever? Yes. So a lot of times when people are making assumptions or trying to just use societal pressure to get you into stuff, versus responding in any way that's defensive or argumentative- Yes or anything, my favorite all-time gold star, triple platinum phrase is, "What do you mean by that?" Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So, "Well, you're gonna... Aren't you gonna bring the other one?" "Well, what do you mean by that?" "Well, you know, all, all the good stu-" "No, what do you mean by that?" Right. B- you can't be, "What do you mean by that?" That, that will not help you. You have to be calm on it. Yeah. But just by- Yeah responding back to that, s- and this works with sexism or cupcakes. I mean, it covers the gamut. Right. Yeah. But just sticking with that phrase- Mm and making them either articulate the thing- Mm-hmm or they recognize the thing that they're going to articulate is bad, and they shut up. Mm-hmm. Yep. But the, "What do you mean by that?" W- don't change it, don't alter it, don't lean into it, just, "What do you mean by that?" Yeah. "No, no, I don't understand. What do you mean by that?" Right. And it, it's gorgeous 'cause it will either shut them up or get them to say something that you can then report to HR. So it's great. Right. The nice part about it, too, is it's the broken record technique, right? Yes. Yep. You just keep repeating it until you get to the understanding of what it is they're really getting at. Yep. Which then you get to respond to instead of... I love that because it takes out the emotion. Yes. Right? And it's just a matter of recognizing that you're uncomfortable. Mm-hmm. You don't know how to necessarily respond. You don't wanna respond in a bad way. Having that phrase- Yeah there at the front of your mind- Yeah saves a lot of that, "Oh, should I, should I? Oh, yeah. Just, "What do you mean by that?" Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. Anything else that's coming up for you? We've covered a lot, and I love how you've given not only examples, but wording and strategies. Anything else that you see that is standing in the way of women's advancement that we haven't touched on? In addition to talking about what you do- Mm-hmm it's very important, this is gonna be a work answer first, but- Sure at work is to have a sponsor, and a lot of people think they have that, but let me... We're gonna do a little pronoun exercise here. Okay. Okay. So a coach is someone who talks with you, meaning, "Hey, I've got a presentation next week. You know, Joe's in the presentation. Joe's always kinda prickly. I'm not quite sure how to do this," and you go with your coach and you figure it out. Mm-hmm. A mentor is someone who talks to you. So when I started working full-time, I had a business dinner. My parents are teachers. There are no business dinners in teaching. And so I called my mentor and I'm like, "What's a business dinner? What do I do? What do I wear? I don't know." And you know, she was very specific on, you know, "It's business casual. only have one drink at dinner. If they go out drinking afterwards, don't go." Yeah. I mean, very, very specific, great information. I'm like, "Yes, ma'am. Thank you." A sponsor is someone who talks for you. Okay. Meaning, when you're not in the room where it happens and they're deciding promotions, they're deciding projects, they're deciding opportunities, their voice is the one who says, "Well, have you considered Denise? Because Denise wants to do X, Y, Z, and when I worked with Denise, she delivered in spades A, B, C. I think that would be a perfect opportunity for Denise." Mm-hmm. Women are over-mentored and under-sponsored. Mm-hmm. And if you're listening to this going- Hmm "I don't have a sponsor," you're probably right, you don't. You need to cultivate one. Now, sponsorship, unlike mentorship, cannot be assigned. Mm-hmm. Sponsorship happens with someone who has worked with you. So maybe not your direct, maybe it's two or three up in a line, but it could've been on a project, it could've been in your regular role, it could've been an... could've been in a DEI cohort. It could've been whatever. But it's someone who has worked with you, has experience with your capabilities, what you deliver, all those kinds of things. Right. And that person has enough sense of who you are to be your voice. Right. So if you have someone, if this is sparking an idea of- I know "Oh yeah, I worked with so-and-so," that c- that person can be a sponsor. Great. Now go cultivate that relationship. Right. Set up coffee. Check in with them. Mm-hmm. Understand what they're working on. Talk about what's keeping them up at night and figure out how you can help. Right. Create that very dynamic relationship with your sponsor so they can be the voice that can speak for you. Love it. And so if you're listening to all of this thinking, "I don't know who that could be, I don't..." Start with your boss. Start with your boss now. Start creating that relationship with your boss, 'cause your boss isn't gonna be your boss forever. They're gonna move roles, you're gonna move roles, those kinds of things happen. Mm-hmm. But start cultivating that. Having sponsors matters. Right. Yeah. And most women don't actively cultivate that relationship. So that's a big one. Mm-hmm. Now, outside of work, when it comes time to be on the charity, be at church, be at the Little League, those kinds of things- Mm-hmm you have to be choiceful in what it is you want. Because too often women are put into, quote unquote, "leadership positions," and then given all the mental load tasks. "Oh, we want you to send out the calendar invites. We want you to send out the emails. We want you to..." Versus actually deciding, "Hey, we need to a- alter the budget this way. We need to think about this for uniform." You get put on menial tasks. So if you're looking to do one of those roles because either you love it, you wanna help out, make sure that the work you're getting isn't going to give you that visceral gut clench. Mm. Mm-hmm. And if it's gonna do that, then say, "Hey, I wanna help, but this is not the way I wanna help. And so if you want help in this space, I am happy to engage, but if this is what you're looking for from me, I just don't have the capacity." Yeah. Great. Great. So you really... I, I love this, because what you are doing is having us pause, step back, and reflect what is it that we really want. Yeah. And until you do that work, these opportunities for your voice to come through will not be as solid as they need to be, 'cause you haven't done the background, what is it that I really want here? Yeah. Nicole's sharing very clearly. You deserve to be able to take that, take the reins of that, discover more about what you want for you, by you, because of you, and go for it. Yep. Be clear on what it is you need, what it is you want, and where you're wanting to be and go and support, and what is too much. And it's okay for the boundaries. Honestly, what we are doing when we're doing this work that you're sharing so beautifully, Nicole, is we are always being observed. Doesn't matter if it's our family, doesn't matter if it's coworkers. You think you're doing your thing and nobody's noticing. Everybody notices. Everybody. Right? Yeah. Yep. So when you take a stand and when you know what it is and who you are and your powerhouse parts, and you are very clear and are able to share that verbally and stand in your truth, everybody else wins. Everybody else wins, because everybody's watching and noticing, "Oh, wow. If she can do that, I could do that." Like I said at the beginning, when one woman turns her light on, the rest of the room catches fire. Yep. It's true. It's 100% true. That's literally what my TED Talk is just about. Right? When women confidently disrupt, everyone benefits. Absolutely. Everyone. Absolutely. This is not about egocentrism. It's the farthest thing from it. Yeah. And don't knock it till you try it. Yep. Now, if- Make it simple you are looking for more phrases and things like that, I will say that I have a whole bunch of this written out in my book. Nice. Which is Taboo Topics: Things Women Should Talk About But Don't. So just as a quick note- Yeah I, the one thing I hate about business books is too often you read an entire business book that does a fantastic job of elucidating the problem and gives you absolutely no solution. Yeah. So you have to find a book to solve the book, and I hate that. Mm. And so I wrote this with very actionable and here's how you do it. Mm-hmm. So, like, if you wanna know how to ask for a raise, there's an email template in here to ask for a raise, you know? And so I, it's, I've tried to make this extremely user-friendly and actionable, and it's got a lot of the phrases, how to approach it, how to poke at it. Things are written in here, so because the language matters. Yeah. And I know that's where a lot of people get caught up, and so I've got examples of it here in the book. Beautiful. And if you are not watching but listening, we will have all of this in the show notes that you can grab- and find it. So if, it's on YouTube and it's a video, but I understand people are walking and doing whatever they're doing and listening, so we will have all of this information in the show notes so you can access not only Nicole and her wisdom, but also the book and a TED Talk that will be coming out sooner than later. Nicole, before we close, is there anything you would love to share with the audience as a last golden nugget? You've given so much already. Is there anything you'd love to make sure our listeners hear as a final take this home and, and, devour it? Remember when you are doing something that you personally consider disruptive, whether it's taking credit or pushing back or just doing something that's against your norm, you might be thinking, "Oh my God, this is awful. I can't do it. It's for me." You are doing this for the benefit of you and everyone else. And women are social creatures. When we're doing it for other people, it's much easier. So you asking for a raise sets the standard that women should all be paid equally. You pushing back on taking notes every time helps all women step back from the mental load. So make sure you recognize while, yes, this is one step for you, it's also a giant leap for womankind, in all seriousness. So it is something bigger than you. And so if it feels like a lot to do that, remember how many women coming after you will benefit from it as well. I love that. Thank you so, so much. I knew this was going to be a rich conversation, and I am so honored to have shared this space, time, and energy with you. Like I said before, in the show notes we'll have all the ways you can find Nicole, contact her, read her book, and, when her TED Talk becomes available, we'll pop it in the show notes so you can grab it there as well. And before we close, I want to share something gently and quietly, but it's becoming more loud, and I'm super thrilled about a live two-day event in person It's called Ignite: The Inner Uprising, and it's a room full of women who are going to be coming together to discover and remember the spark that exists deep within them that's been buried for so long. As Nicole shared, the social pressures, the, the, the world we live in and the expectations that we... people assume we are who we are, and we, we've begun to understand very differently. We're gonna come together, uncover that spark put oxygen to it, and watch it grow. So if this conversation resonated with you, if this Ignite: The Inner Uprising tickles your fancy, please, please, please check the show notes. There's a link there. Tickets are going to become available very soon. We're just finishing that up on the back end, and I can't wait to see everybody who's able to make it to Vancouver Nicole, thank you again for being such a wonderful addition to Thrive After 45. Your gifts and talents, I'm so glad that you've taken the leap that you've taken, and the world benefits because of it. So thank you so much for being here. Thank you for doing the wonderful work you are. I appreciate being here. Have a wonderful day, and make sure that you thrive after 45. Bye now.